I like MCE but I just haven't got excited about EI yet. My rep is awesome but everyone from the factory is tight lipped or just doesn't seem to know any answers.

I agree with Julie about the marketing of these companies. I would love to have my booth next to the Viking people at the International Builders show.

Mike

New but ready to talk.

Guys I have followed this blog for the last few years, but never joined. I would like to introduce my self and start to give you all some real answers to the topics around lifeware. I am Steve Cashman, VP of Sales for EI. I have over 10 years of industry experience, prior to EI I owned an integration company in Colorado, still in business, and we did AMX, Lutron homeworks, and high end audio and theaters. Small company with 6-8 techs and a light sales and design staff with out sourced programming. I joined EI about 14 months ago and only after taking a lifeware system and installing it in my own residence, did i join the company and relocate from colorado to Columbus Ohio.

I will be short about the topic of the builder program, what we launched was a builder incentive program that had pre designed packages for builders to spec in to a new construction project, and upon doing so they come back thru EI's web portal and are refferred to two Cedia Custom Installers that have signed up to particpate in the Builder Program. The systems start at about 30K and range to 75k and include MCE, lutron lighting, aprilaire thermostats, panasonic cameras, russound audio, and misc displays and components. Dealers that are members of the builder program get full wiring schematics, marketing materials, and exceptionally hi margins and some new added builder relationships. A true win-win. EI does not sell to builders, only to certified installers.

I also personally challenge you to come out to either our headquarters or one of the trade shows and meet with me or a member of our team. The sales team all has varied industry experience from lutron, vantage, panasonic, channel vision, and much more. ALthough not every member of the team maybe as technical as you need, we do have a technical sales team that reports to me that has been doing high end systems in yachts, MDUs, and premium luxury residences for their entire careers. Yes we are working with teams like BBY, but we are also helping grow the CEDIA marketplace and we are managing very tightly what features, functions, and models are out in the marketplace to help deliniate who does and is capable of what.

As far as MCE goes, I personally discreditted it and many that know me would even say that I mocked it prior to getting to know it. Guys I have sold control systems from 20K up to 486K in my career as a integrator. I can guarantee you that MCE is the best Media and Content management software available to you today. I can also tell you with folks like walmart and Best Buy announcing movie downloads that need a PC in the living room, this is something that is only going to become more prodominant in your space, much like integrating a cable or satellite box. Today there are some fairly lucrative MCE hardware peices that are very stable and if you take time to learn and understand the platform, there is a solid business model there. That aside, Lifeware is the ultimate hi profit integration peice in the market today. You get to pick your favorite subsystems and have them all integrate and work together thru a very easy to use standards based interface. And guess what, even if the MCE would have a problem, it doesn't affect subsystem functionality.

We are a company built out of service, high quality product standards, and built out of our own financial means and hard work. Our CEO owns an integration company, that he saved from financial crisis and learned all about the problems of the small integrator plagued by a highly paid programmer, long lead time build cycles, the lack of system replicatability, and the fact that the majority of homeowners are unhappy with the experience they have had with the current control systems on the market. We realize we have picked the path of most resistent, but we also realize that the issues of DRM, content distribution, and media management, are driving factors for what the consumer expects and Microsoft is serious about owning the marketplace for those services and thus far the marketplace is accepting that. SO we have set out to provide you with a tool to be successful in this convergence space and we will be the best partner that you will find. If you would take time to get to know our product, i think you will see some things you like, we also would love to have your feedback as to what we can add/change to make it better. If MCE is the problem, keep in that many products that you love and use have some peice of the Microsoft platform involved, if nothing else, the machince that you are programming them with. Feel free to email me personally or comment. We take your opinions and business very seriously. I have personally helped by turning the screwdriver at projects with new customers and you can expect that type of dedication if you join the EI dealer network.


Sincerely

Steve Cashman

Not even remotely close. If you honestly think that trying to train a client on how to jump through multiple hoops to simply rip a single movie (and God forbid it be a Disney or Sony Pictures release) is the best scenario, then you're overstating your credentials. Love 'em or hate 'em, dedicated servers kick the ever living crap out of any MCE platform. PERIOD. No comparison.



Agreed. There are other options, though. DRM is the biggest struggle there.


Debate-able but I do agree to a point. Niveus makes a great machine. But they attempt to sell it as an all in one entertainment center replacing all but the amp. Yeah, right. Cable freakin' card...c'mon. We live and work in the real world.

|That aside, Lifeware is the ultimate hi profit

Highly debate-able...

|we also would love to have your

Adjust your outrageous TP pricing or be more honest about a cost comparison with the industry leaders. It's an "either/or" scenario.

When I state "media management"it is by far the best, I am referencing it being the best all in one, i agree that kaliedescape is a very nice DVD system, the price is signfigantly more, i also have had previous Request experience, good product as well, but stand alone. I would also challenge how service comes into play. With the above systems remote diagnoses, remote media management, and training is impossible. With MCE you could have a box in your living room right now and i could remote in and build you a playlist, start a movie, or have you wake up to my favorite music.

As far as touchpanels are concerned, I am running the Samsung Q1 in my home, you can buy it for under 1K and it does a great job, you will start to see a lot of readily available panels for the platform, profitability does come into the scenario, but adding lifeware client app to a Samsung Q1 adds you some high margin high function secret sauce that the homeowner can't shop.

Even ASSUMING that's true (and I don't), that's sort of like saying Rosanne Barr is the sexiest woman in the room when the room contains three women and the other two women are Margaret Thatcher and Barbara Bush. i.e. software based media centers are not exactly a thriving field (yet).

I think for a couple hundred dollars a person could purchase some software from Cinemar online that also provides all in one media management with a much better UI than MS. Unfortunately it's not as plug and play yet. Bottom line, I've now tested Media Center extensively and the only thing I'm amazed by is how once this hundred billion dollar company can't design a good piece of software. It's JUNK.

Then again, they did just spend several billion dollars and five years developing Vista to the point that it has (gasp) translucent windows and decent search. Things I already have in XP from using very nice add-ons from small software companies. Sorry, I'm just not an MS fan. I know you know that's one of the challenges you have to address with integrators. The problem is that you profess how great MCE is til you're blue in the face but until the the facts reflect it, we won't go for it.

p.s. Did you hear about all the midnight openings retial stores had for Vista...and like 5 people showed up to them?

I think we should look at market trends and market share after Apple TV is released and see what it does well and where it fails. The Apple product is not a DVR, but an extension for the downloadable media / purchased content environment, via iTunes. The MCE addresses DVR functionality, but with cable / sat providers offering cheap, almost free solutions, MCE is not really filling a market demand, but mostly catering to hobbyists and enthusiasts. The argument for an increase in this method / technology in the living room might be empty or proved false, by a reasonably potential scenario where iTunes and Apple TV dominates this space and MCE becomes a technical knockout with its HD CABLECARD support, but in practice a market oddity with respect to its sales as an "appliance". The second part of the argument, downloadable content and e-commerce, will in my estimates, be won decisively by Apple. So in the end, MCE will be a relatively expensive, complicated, and some would say, unreliable product, while the Apple will be a cheap, reliable, and tightly focused appliance, aimed at expanding its already established iTunes environment. Personally, I do not really see any real potential for MCE or more accurately, Vista, to break into this market. In many ways, I see Vista as the current generation of the "Windows ME" experience.

This only addresses one aspect of which your platform is based. It is not fair to compare mainspace consumer habits of a product with a customized implementation of that application in a high end space. However, any product that is tied into a product like MS / Vista / MCE, will inevitably be tied to marketspace / market health factors.

I don't know where to even begin. I could write a college thesis on the aspects of this tread, and I don't have that kind of time, so I'll just toss out a few talking points.

Steve, you mentioned that you were a MCE skeptic, but tried out an EI product, became a believer, and 14 months ago, joined the company. Since MCE hasn't been out all that long, why did you become so convinced, over a short period of time, that it was all that and more?

I'd say that 90% of my customers want less Microsoft in their lives and not more.

MCE as the best media managment system out there? C'mon, you're not serious are you?

It's interesting how manufacturers quietly, in passing mention the Best Buy partnerships like it's a footnote. When you were with your former company, would the fact that a product line had decided to form a partnership with Best Buy not have swayed your interest in that line?

Your CEO had an epiphany and realized that "the majority of homeowners are unhappy with the experience they have had with the current control systems on the market."?

I would say that (if true) the majority of those homeowners must have had their systems installed by unqualified hacks.

Oh, I almost forgot.....

Since EI and Control4 are both Best Buy lines, Do you see the two being able to coexist over the long haul?

In what circumstance would a potential customer be steered towards one or the other?

How would you persuade a potential dealer into selling your mass merchandised products over a protected line such as Crestron?

This statement raises two issues. One, you are unfamiliar with the remote capabilities of dedicated servers. I am an Xperinet dealer. Remote diagnoses is not only possible but, were a hard drive in the RAID array to go down, I get an email and show up at my client's home with a replacement and they would never even know there was a problem. Two, you openly bring up what is ultimately one of Microsoft's biggest problems. Security. It's not only vulnerable but a clear hacker target....Ping.

I wish I could agree with you, but after having run Vista MCE in my own home since Nov, I would be extremely uncomfortable selling a Vista MCE box to a client. Still far too many stability/usability issues...granted, this is an HP DEC box, not Niveus, but it seems unlikely to me that the latter would resolve these issues. And yes, I do have said box optimized/tweaked (I'm an IT guy, working w/win32 for 10+ years).



This I can agree with - in fact, I'd take it one step further and say the "Windows XP - when properly optimized/configured - can be a _very_ stable platform.

I'd really like to know where the great margin would come from on a Samsung Q1 when they are availabe all over the net for less than a grand. I also find it funny that instead of one of EI's own wa expensive touchpanel, the VP of sales uses a cheap third party panel.

All of the exizting high end media managers have remote capabilities, as do the existing control systems, lighting systems etc.

I may be dense, but I'm still not getting this. Also, EI seems to have a partnership with HP, but all I here about now is , use Niveus cause they build a stabe platform. Well that may be, but it is at 3 times the cost of even the overpriced and underwhelming HP MCE boxes.

Does anyone know if BB will have a dedicated staff to program and troubleshoot these EI systems?

New CI HP Box $2995.00

[Link: shopping.hp.com]

vs.

Niveus Ranier $3100.00 MSRP.
[Link: store.niveusmedia.com]

Steve I had the opportunity to meet you a few years ago when you were working for another startup company that made an exclusive appearance at Cedia. That company was Colorado Vnet. I remember either you or one of your coworkers touting many of the somethings you said here. The great customer service, how great the product is and all the things you were coming out with and the speed that they were going to be developed. Basically things that you as a former integrater would have wanted to hear. Well I have to say that vNet definately has some interesting approaches, they need to hirer and industrial designer to work on some cosmeticts of there products. Now that you're with another startup with, yep same story really deap pockets, you say one thing and then do another. What I see is a company that takes their product and sell it to whomever will buy it and promise them the world (Are we going to see a version of your product in A#I anytime soon under another name?) Once you get the bugs worked out, you go to the big retailer like BB or CC or CompUSA or even WaI-Mart. Where does that leave the CI? No wonder you receive so much resistance. Sure the builder programs sound great, but where do you expect the majority of your sales to come from? Maybe an "Automation in a Box" from BB that can be retrofited?

A quick question for you. Where do you see the CI in your business plan? I dought you'll answer this, but does EI have any plans on utilizing the CI channel long term.

On another note I think we all understand you're a very busy person and do appreciate your feedback and input here.

Hopefully Steve can clarify, but I beleive I read that this was going to be outsourced and handled initially by EI until numbers were high enough for BB to handle them. Either way I can see this being outsourced to a third party.