This makes sense. Until a couple of hacks start programming things for super cheap and taking business away because the programming is simple and investment (time or money) is minimal. Then 2 months later they are out of business because they never made any money. Now customers complain that CIs are flaky and always going out of business.


This just comes from experience. Not reasoning. I have some very intelligent associates that are electricians that couldnt wire an AV system if the had too. Heck, I dont do electrical. However, I am sure there are competent electricians that can install AV. Just because you pull wire doesnt make you a CI or an electrician.


This really isnt a matter of being stubborn. Some product just doesn't work in some situations. If there is a solution that exists and you are capable of offering it then you should.

Cookie cutter systems work. As long as the CI isnt depriving a client of a solution just for the paycheck when an actual solution exists.



I buy through disty a lot. In fact, we are probably one of their biggest dealers down here. It saves us money on a larger warehouse and time tracking shipments.

Also, I think retail sales help the client see the product and gain interest in it. I loved having Tweeter around. It was like CI 101 for my clients.


1 out of 4 is not bad.

More power to you if you can sell a more future-proof solution. THat's what good integrators do.

But why be critical about the availability of new options?

I agree with you on the fact that the problem is that it is a proprietary addition to a system. On the other hand the way I look at it, it is a VERY SIMPLE solution for a customer that might not have gone with lighting control in a surround sound system but because of the minimal cost will allow this customer to purchase lighting control. Thus in turn allowing for additional margin (might be small margin, but margin none the less).



We currently sell lighting control, but it economic systems we have a lot of customer's that are not interested in lighting control because of cost. This just allows for a broader customer base for lighting control.



Very rarely do I get shopped by a customer to ebay, firedog, or geek squad. When I do it is normally a customer that is looking for a more economic solution which this lighting control solution is. Firedog and Geek Squad cannot offer electrical solutions they are not licensed electricians. And do not contract to an electrician.

You said "I wish that RTI would come up with a solution like this with Lutron, even if it was with a converter box"
To which I gave obvious answers (in the form of ? did make it seem a bit smart ass'ish). Apparently you are already quite aware of these obvious answers, so I guess your statement was for what purpose ???

I look like a fool? OK, so be it.

So you get your foot in the door with lighting control. Very positive. But then the client sees just how cool lighting control can be and wants to upgrade to RadioRA. Now you have to tell them that what they just spent $600 + install on products that won't interface and will have to be upgraded.

So give him a Trade-in on the URC stuff.....

Goodness.... I've never seen people upset over a potential opportunity to sel more stuff before......

Keep one or two in stock for demo purposes. Install them on a trial basis, and see if they're interested, (like anyone would want it removed after getting to play with it). I wouldn't be surprised if it generated more full blown lighting control upgrades.

Approach it for what it is for CIs. A cheap way to show your cilents how convenient lighting control can be.

Why wouldn't you explain this to them ahead of time.
-"If you are interested in lighting control....there are more robust whole house solutions.
If you don't care to spend the money right now we can do a simple single room solution."


I can't understand why any of you consider this to be problem.

^^^ I agree ^^^^

It's not like these are going to take away from Vantage, Lutron, Crestron lighting jobs. Some of the people complaining about it don't even deal with URC. If explained properly and sold for what it is (simple, one room solution), you now have a client that may get the lighting control bug in the future. And guess what, keep the one room solution up and running as it was, now it's time to step it up a notch for the rest of the house....no problem!

Except they don't integrate with other Lutron RF products so real whole-house control without replacing them is not possible. For a few more $ they can have a GrafikRA which will integrate.

And yes, this may be a great solution for lower-end installs, but it will probably be more of a boon to a DIY.

Right, my point was the room (presumably a media room) could stay the same. Or yeah change it all out if they want, I'm all for upgrades :-) I tend to treat media rooms as a separate entity in regards to equipment and control anyway.

Since when did "a few more" mean "triple the amount"...?

And then you'd still have to blend it into their URC remote.

(comparing apples to apples)

I don't know why everyone is getting upset.. from what I see with the limited amount of programming capabilities on this system it will never replace anything other than a Lutron Spacer. It will only make it slightly more reliable. These dimmers and their capabilities are not even comparable to RadioRa let alone a truly viable whole house system like Vantage, LiteTouch or HomeWorks. These switches might get someone interested in lighting, but these are in no way a replacement for any of the 4 systems I listed previously.

If a $150 dimmer will sell a client on a whole house lighting job, I'll gladly deduct the purchase price off of the new system!!

I might even consider throwing in the used dimmer on the next job in hopes that I would get the same results!

Many of my clients can't justify a lighting system because they haven't experienced one and can't relate to how it would work for them in their daly life.

If a little preview would alter their thinking,this thing could be a jewel.

i just received 5 of the lutron MRFA-600m-urc dimmers and after 1 hour of messing around with the URC downloaded controls and programming the dimmers, let me be the first to say i had a heck of a time getting them to work.

more than 50% of the time after pressing the button on the remote the dimmer fails to receive the command, and you have to hold down the button for it to work. The scenes dont program the way they advertise.

i tried to control them thru a mx3000 and a kp-900....same results both time.

After considerable time with URC technical support, i found that i have to install macros under every button, adding time delays and repeat functions under every comand line to get it to work properly. sometimes adding 5 repeat comands for every macro. but now it is working properly.

man. i love the control i get, but the programming is a real nitemare IMO.