Jim,

Yeah, but I just couldn't resist mentioning the vision I had of these suits being handcuffed and dragged out of their offices to jail with slightly puzzled, fearful looks on their faces. ;)

If they seriously think such a backwards, absurdly counterproductive, and offensive policy would actual increase their revenues, they definitely need to get out more.

Everyone including Philips execs.

I own and program pronto's and rc5000 for a living.
I walked into a best buys the other day and questioned the braindead salesperson . " What can you tell me about this Pronto? " (playing the uninformed customer)
His comment was " It's a universal remote that you can
learn any remote with" HUH ? When I asked about what you can do with it in the way of customizing screens.
"thats the way it comes and you cant change them"
ok my question is would you rather buy something from
a huge retailer that does not have a clue what they are selling or an e-comerace site that can at least steer you in the direction of the correct answer.
I buy them wholesale and sell then a little under MFSR
best is selling them at 368+75 for the docking station.
look I know what my cost is and there is plenty of room for compitition. Ignorance is bliss hahahaha
Wake up Magnavox/Philips we have the numbers .
Anyone there ever hear of antitrust laws ? or Class Action ?

Thats my two pennies
Kevin

Tom,

Again, I agree. I don't think it would be a profitable business practice. On the other hand, lots of companies do it, and come to think of it, nobodies ever offered me a CEO position.

Jim L

Why is it legal for manufacturers to restrict who distributors can sell to? Surely that not only restricts the consumers choice, but the potential profits of the distributor? I guess this is all down to the balance of power. If you are a big manufacturer, the distributor wants your business.

I suppose Philips and others want to protect their relationships with the big chains. But whatever happened to competition?

It seems crazy to crack down on companies like Microsoft, simply because they are big. What happened to equality? Even if you are a little company, you should play by the same rules.

I bought my Pronto over the internet, after reading about it on the internet, and downloading the software on the internet. I have never seen it in a store.

Shrug, it's just another reason to never buy a Phillips product again. I've currently got a wealth of Phillips electronics devices - a 32" TV, a Phillips TiVo, a Marantz SR-96, a Marantz CD changer, and of course, a Phillips Pronto. It wasn't really intentional to buy 3/4s of my electronics from one manufacturer, but that's how it ended up.

But after having sent my TiVo in for replacement (15 days out of warantee), and seeing this (if true) I doubt I'll consider another one of their products. Why? Because while they may have good, competitive products their customer service STINKS. As many others have mentioned there's more to a good value than price alone. And Phillips total uncaring attitude toward those who buy and use their products really negates any price advantage they have IMO.

To be clear, I had GREAT customer service from TiVo. But even TiVo told me that their _only_ contact with Phillips was via email. And all the information on Phillips' website regarding TiVo winds up pointing you back to TiVo, Inc. The odds of my ever finding out what fryed my TiVo are exceptionally low (and since I may end up suing my cable company regarding this it's rather important). I tried to get a contact number for Phillips and wound up talking to someone in Ohio that had no clue what was happening at the repair facility in El Paso, TX.

As for legality - I'm sure the deal is that distributors have to sign agreements to sell Phillips products. That's legal. Now it's not clear to me how Phillips can decree who the distributors can sell to via these agreements without that being restraint of trade. There would obviously be certain conditions which would be legal (providing adequate customer support, etc.), but I can't imagine others being anything other than restraint of trade. But hey, I'm no lawyer.

A few years back my biggest competitor sent out letters to all of their distributors. They stated that their products would no longer be available to distributors that did not support them 100%. They even cut off certain distributors right away. Within a month my business increased more than 300%, Their sales went in the crapper, and I made a healthy bonus that year. My competition did me a huge favor. They did finally see the light and began embracing these distributors again, but the damage was done.

I work for a Philips division, but I can see no merit to their decision. There are several nice remotes becoming available now and Philips stands to lose the cult status that Pronto has earned. I'll bet a nickle that they reverse this policy before the first snow falls in the midwest.

I doubt phillips has done anything illegal. Price fixing is what an industry does, not a manufacturer. I make unique coffee tables. If I decide to constrain how MY TABLES are sold in order to keep the price at a certain level it's perfectly legal. It may not help me sell any coffee tables, but it's not illegal. I have the right to set my price and try to keep the price at a profitable level.

If I conspire with all coffee table sources in my area to stop competing and hold their prices high and equal to mine then THAT is price fixing. The gas companies seem to do this all the time. Gas prices in my state dropped 50 cents when the state attorney mentioned "look into", "price fixing", and "Gas prices" in the same sentence. One local gas station has kept his prices high. He doesn't sell much gas, but he's also not doing anything illegal anymore. He's just not willing to compete.

I think phillips has realized they have a unique product and that it's worth more (thanks to this site) than most of us paid for it. Their long time retail dealers have probably complained about losing sales to internet stores, and demanded phillips do something about it. Those stores (like every other retail store) probably like to charge more for the product ($400ish for a pronto) than their internet counterparts, partly to cover their cost in handholding the buyer through the setup/programming process. Any net-smart consumer realizes he/she can (could?) get one cheaper on the web. If an electronics store threatens to stop carrying ANY phillips products if they don't get some action to shut down internet competition, I suspect phillips would respond to try and keep their storefront retail dealers. In fact, I think that's exactly what they've done. They may be acting not to preserve the market for their Pronto, but instead to preserve the dealers of their more profitable (TVs, etc.) electronics.

My two cents. I don't care much for phillip's policy, but then again, I already have my pronto.

dave

Brian I think your 100% right.

Personally, I think that Phillips is setting themselves up for a knowck-off company to come in and eat their lunch.

It would not be difficult for an offshore company to create an equivilent product with an editor that could convert Pronto CCFs. If they market through the internet, they will be able to offer a compatible product for half the cost - and Phillis will have alredy burned thier bridges.

By the way, I did by mine though a retail store and intend to by 2 more and want to buy them through the web. I will consider alternatives.

Kevin, who the hell is Brian? :)

LOL....I mean Bill :-)

LOL....I mean David. Man Im a mess....

Kevin,

Pass some of that over /here/ please ;)

Laurie