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Google WiFi question
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Post 1 made on Tuesday July 28, 2020 at 08:25
goldenzrule
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I will start by saying Google WiFi is possibly the worst system I have seen.  Incredibly limited settings and works about as well at providing wifi as a pile of dog crap in a yard.

With that out of the way :-)

I was brought in to extend a network from a house to a barn to provide internet to the office space in the second level.  Hardwire connection works fine, no dropouts, full throughput speeds.  The client had the Google system prior to calling use to extend the wiring to the barn.  He purchased a second kit to provide the wifi out there, which we connected.  The second kit is hardwired directly to the main Google WiFi unit in the house.  The google search I did said that the second unit should automatically set itself as a "slave" unit or whatever term it used.  It has constant drop outs, every minute, and speeds will sometimes be fast and often really slow.  All the while, hardwiring through the Google WiFi unit in the barn still provides a constant connection and full speeds.

Client claims there are issues in the house as well, however this was not discovered during my visit and I have not been back to confirm.  I will say that they have Altice One for ISP which uses a ridiculous router built into the cable box.  You cannot set it to bridge mode or shut off routing in any way.  Google WiFi cannot be set to bridge mode as it turns off mesh (at least to my knowledge, I know it was like this previously and assume its still the same).  So he has a Double NAT.  I instructed him that he will need to either change his internet service to Optimum provided by the same company which will utilize a regular modem, or switch to something like Eero for wifi.

Does anyone have experience with Google WiFi that would know if we can solve the issues with that system, or if the Double NAT is the issue?  Client claims it as solid before adding the second Google kit, so I am wondering if it did not shut off the router functions on that as the search I did led me to believe it would.  I instructed him to call Google to see what options we have, if any with this system.  I have very little experience with Google WiFi as we have steered people clear of it after issues in the past, but this client had already purchased it before we could have a conversation with them.
Post 2 made on Tuesday July 28, 2020 at 09:03
highfigh
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On July 28, 2020 at 08:25, goldenzrule said...
I will start by saying Google WiFi is possibly the worst system I have seen.  Incredibly limited settings and works about as well at providing wifi as a pile of dog crap in a yard.

With that out of the way :-)

I was brought in to extend a network from a house to a barn to provide internet to the office space in the second level.  Hardwire connection works fine, no dropouts, full throughput speeds.  The client had the Google system prior to calling use to extend the wiring to the barn.  He purchased a second kit to provide the wifi out there, which we connected.  The second kit is hardwired directly to the main Google WiFi unit in the house.  The google search I did said that the second unit should automatically set itself as a "slave" unit or whatever term it used.  It has constant drop outs, every minute, and speeds will sometimes be fast and often really slow.  All the while, hardwiring through the Google WiFi unit in the barn still provides a constant connection and full speeds.

Client claims there are issues in the house as well, however this was not discovered during my visit and I have not been back to confirm.  I will say that they have Altice One for ISP which uses a ridiculous router built into the cable box.  You cannot set it to bridge mode or shut off routing in any way.  Google WiFi cannot be set to bridge mode as it turns off mesh (at least to my knowledge, I know it was like this previously and assume its still the same).  So he has a Double NAT.  I instructed him that he will need to either change his internet service to Optimum provided by the same company which will utilize a regular modem, or switch to something like Eero for wifi.

Does anyone have experience with Google WiFi that would know if we can solve the issues with that system, or if the Double NAT is the issue?  Client claims it as solid before adding the second Google kit, so I am wondering if it did not shut off the router functions on that as the search I did led me to believe it would.  I instructed him to call Google to see what options we have, if any with this system.  I have very little experience with Google WiFi as we have steered people clear of it after issues in the past, but this client had already purchased it before we could have a conversation with them.

I'm not sure the client will ask the right questions if they call Google. I posted about a job where I had installed EERO but it was replaced after the freaking genius from Spectrum told him it's not a good system, so he switched to Google because he has it at his other house. I'm not convinced it will do the job but I'm planning to install their app on my phone and get his log-in info so I can look at the settings. So far, I haven't seen speeds that were close to the EERO system and his tail was between his legs when we talked about this. At this point, we're planning for me to run a cable from the basement to the storage area behind the TV and Roku, so another Google unit can be placed there as a way to boost the signal. I'm not hopeful that it will be great.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 3 made on Tuesday July 28, 2020 at 13:31
Ernie Gilman
Yes, That Ernie!
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On July 28, 2020 at 09:03, highfigh said...
...EERO but it was replaced after the freaking genius from Spectrum told him it's not a good system, so he switched to Google because he has it at his other house.
...So far, I haven't seen speeds that were close to the EERO system and his tail was between his legs when we talked about this.

I hope either of two things:

My preference would be that you're saying the SpectroGenius had his tail between his legs, which might mean he could be on the hook for reinstalling an EERO system, though if you're referring to the client, that would at least mean you don't have an uphill fight against a client who'll blame you for something.

Best of luck with that. Installers should learn early on (but they/most of us don't) that if you touch it, you own it and you own all problems that roll downhill from that decision.
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
OP | Post 4 made on Tuesday July 28, 2020 at 17:01
goldenzrule
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On July 28, 2020 at 09:03, highfigh said...
I'm not sure the client will ask the right questions if they call Google. I posted about a job where I had installed EERO but it was replaced after the freaking genius from Spectrum told him it's not a good system, so he switched to Google because he has it at his other house. I'm not convinced it will do the job but I'm planning to install their app on my phone and get his log-in info so I can look at the settings. So far, I haven't seen speeds that were close to the EERO system and his tail was between his legs when we talked about this. At this point, we're planning for me to run a cable from the basement to the storage area behind the TV and Roku, so another Google unit can be placed there as a way to boost the signal. I'm not hopeful that it will be great.

I sent him an email with specific questions to ask and instructed him to jot down the answers. We'll see. Google WiFi is terrible. Beyond terrible, yet because it has the name Google attached to it, I see unsuspecting people recommending it all the time. Always for their sub 2000 square foot square, sheetrock house with 10 devices MAX on wifi. I did a job 2 weeks ok that also had Altice One. It was being installed while I was there. The client asked the cable guy, and not me, about getting better wifi signal upstairs. Keep in mind, Altice One uses the cable boxes as access points. Rather than say just add a cable box upstairs, he tells him to get Google WiFi. Said he uses it at home with Altice One and loves it. So I stepped in and said you cannot use Google WiFi with Altice one as neither system can be bridged, so you end with a Double NAT. Before I could finish, he said, I love the Double NAT, I can be on one network and my son games on the other. I just said to the client, we'll talk when he leaves.
Post 5 made on Wednesday July 29, 2020 at 08:22
highfigh
Loyal Member
Joined:
Posts:
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7,617
On July 28, 2020 at 13:31, Ernie Gilman said...
I hope either of two things:

My preference would be that you're saying the SpectroGenius had his tail between his legs, which might mean he could be on the hook for reinstalling an EERO system, though if you're referring to the client, that would at least mean you don't have an uphill fight against a client who'll blame you for something.

Best of luck with that. Installers should learn early on (but they/most of us don't) that if you touch it, you own it and you own all problems that roll downhill from that decision.

It was the customer and it was because he listened to Cable Guy- he doesn't blame me for this, at all. I had installed outdoor speakers, a multi-channel amp, the EERO, three Sonos Connects, solved some indoor cabling issues and just yesterday, sent an estimate for the equipment to move the Roku, another Sonos, mount a sealed outdoor box, add another AP, a network switch and some kind of IR control to eliminate juggling remotes (the TV doesn't have a jack for the IR commands and only three controller companies work with IP commands). I also have a replacement TV coming because the original doesn't react to IR commands and I'm not the original seller, who is out of the picture because they dropped the ball on this. He apologized for not buying the TV from me and rather than act like he kicked my puppy, I cheerfully went there and solved the immediate problems of the TV and ROKU not connecting to the network and in the case of the ROKU, pairing the remote. The seller has since shown their lack of accurate record keeping WRT the TV, since the serial # on the original invoice wasn't correct- the number given after subsequent calls is for a TV that had already been returned to the manufacturer and upon finding that replacing all of the internal modules didn't cure the problem, it was scrapped.

At this point, I'm OK the guy is pretty easy going and I was referred by a previous client, who was a referral from another previous client.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 6 made on Wednesday July 29, 2020 at 08:34
highfigh
Loyal Member
Joined:
Posts:
September 2004
7,617
On July 28, 2020 at 17:01, goldenzrule said...
I sent him an email with specific questions to ask and instructed him to jot down the answers. We'll see. Google WiFi is terrible. Beyond terrible, yet because it has the name Google attached to it, I see unsuspecting people recommending it all the time. Always for their sub 2000 square foot square, sheetrock house with 10 devices MAX on wifi. I did a job 2 weeks ok that also had Altice One. It was being installed while I was there. The client asked the cable guy, and not me, about getting better wifi signal upstairs. Keep in mind, Altice One uses the cable boxes as access points. Rather than say just add a cable box upstairs, he tells him to get Google WiFi. Said he uses it at home with Altice One and loves it. So I stepped in and said you cannot use Google WiFi with Altice one as neither system can be bridged, so you end with a Double NAT. Before I could finish, he said, I love the Double NAT, I can be on one network and my son games on the other. I just said to the client, we'll talk when he leaves.

I think the lake house with the Google that replaced EERO may be getting some new EERO, at some point. The electrician had installed a bunch of Nest cameras and thermostats, they have lots of hand-helds & laptops and the last time I could see what was on the network, I think they had 23 devices.

If only they trained their techs to understand that 'Double NAT' is not the same as having two somewhat isolated SSIDs. Maybe you could have asked him what 'NAT' is.

I had an interesting conversation with one of the engineers who works in the cellular phone area for ATT- the installers for the cell towers and other infrastructure caused many performance problems by using the wrong connectors, wrong tools, bending the crap out of 7/8" coax in the sheds and band-aids to fix problems that wouldn't be terribly difficult to solve, if done correctly.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."


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