I'm simply hooking a single silicon solar cell to the oscilloscope leads. The IR creates enough electrical output in the cell to read the pulses. If you can record the pulse sequence on your computer based scope, I think we could try some hand encoding. We'd need the full IR sequence of a key captured and also the sweep rate of the scope to read the stream.

Not much luck so far, all Im getting is pulses at 25ms spacing when pressing any button, could be that the scope or solar cell is not up to detecting the high frequency part.Any idea of the expected length of the full sequence?

IRDA can use bit rates up to 115200/second which translates to pulses as short as 0.008680556 milliseconds so I think those 25 ms pulses you are seeing are actually packets of the finer pulses. Can you speed up the time base of the scope some more?

Guy,

I have been extremely interested in the experiments you have conducted regarding sending unmodulated pulse streams. Being a new pronto owner (1 week so far) who unfortunately has a Pace Digital Cable STB, I am willing to pursue a solution to this problem.

I was able to borrow a digital storage scope and have sampled the transmission from my pace remote. As Merv has observed it consists of packets of data, spaced by 24.26245ms. The first 8 packets appear to contain the data, the packet nine and onward is a repetition of the packet eight, for as long as the remote button is held down.

Unfortunately, I have not had any success hand-coding the unmodulated pulse patterns. Could you provide more detail on the experiments you have performed. Examples of the codes you have used and their resultant waveforms would be useful.

Is the hex code format identical to modulated signals, i.e. word two defines the clock frequency, and hence the pulse high time for a burst pair of 0001 0001? Are there any similar limitations as found with modulated signals (i.e a low time must be at least 2 carrier clock cycles)?

Although the pace remote uses 115kbaud, a logic high has a high time (LED On) of 1.74us followed by 6.94us of low (LED Off), a logic low is just 8.68us of low (LED Off). Have you been able to produce pulses this short in your experiments?

Also do you know the maximum frequency the hex code can be encoded at. According to the formulae, an N = 1 should give a frequency of 4.145146MHz. Can this actually be used?

As you can see, I didnt get very far with my experiment
Even at a timebase setting of 2ms per division (giving 25ms across the display) Either the Scope software or the solar cell are not up to it. Its good to see someone getting results, lets hope Guy can help.

Steve, I'm surprised the duty cycle is that low. Maybe some part of your test setup is not reponding fast enough. It doesn't matter much once you know the bit sequence, you can try the Pronto with the observed duty cycle and try it again with a higher duty cycle.

Do you get a good enough view to write down the whole bit sequence? Do you have the patience?!

You should download my Makehex program from the utilities area here. It should be easy to write an IRP file that generates a code with the same timing as the Pace (If you don't know how, ask and I will post one). Even before you find the correct bit sequence, it would be a good idea to use your storage scope to look at what the Pronto actually sends when you program it to match the Pace timing.

I too was suprised how low the duty cycle is, but I am sure the test circuit was not distorting the waveforms. I was capturing clean pulse with rise and fall times in the region of 200ns. I used a BPW41N high speed IR PiN diode as part of my test circuit.

I do have the entire bit sequence as raw sampled data, all 2Megs worth at 5MS/s. I am working on some software which will convert the raw sample data into the 115kbaud bit pattern and then to Pronto Hex format as I certainly do not have the patience to do it by hand.

Unfortunately, I no longer have access to a digital storage scope, as I am in the process of changing jobs and left my old company on Thursday, hence I can no longer borrow their £30k scope. Hopefully I will be able to borrow another scope soon.

If someone has a scope, a pronto, and some patience I would be grateful if they could see if the pronto can cleanly generate arbitrary bit patterns of the timings I previously discussed.

In the meantime, I will have a look at your MakeHex utility. Hopefully all this effort will be worth it in the end. At this stage I am just trying to determine if the Pronto is capable of generating the high speed bit patterns required, before I start trying to convert the 80Megs worth of sample data I have into Hex codes.

I see some progress has been made while I was distracted. (Just cracked the high freq Electrohome problem) At my next free time slot I'll look some more at this problem. The multiple packets seen on the storage scope is consistent with what we were told about the IRDA transmission. It has several bytes. Most of them are probably machine ID. I'd expect only one or two bytes of actual code data to vary between the keys. We also have to look out for parity changing the apparent code.

Having had numerous problems with C&W/NTL with getting connected to digital cable and complained to everybody about their lack of assistance, I have found myself in a very firtunate position where they are now being very willing to help me. My problem, similar to many in the forum is that all my "gear" (DVD, Laser Disc, CD, Video, Amp and so on) is located in a closed cupboard. In order for me to use the Marantz I have had installed a IR receiver and which send the signals to the units.

My question is.

1) C&W/NTL can supply a similar kit that allows for use or their renote in another room allowing users to chnage channel etc. Is there a similar device that could boost the signal from the Marantz?

2) Will the RC5000i be able to handle the IRDA?

Let me know what I can do to help.

In answer to your questions -

1/ You can get a unit that will allow your Marantz to work in an other room from letautomate.com, see remote
accessories, Powermid XL.

2/ No - your Marantz (or Pronto) will not work with the pace box as it uses IRDA, and thats what this 2 page thread is all about.

I see that the proposed ProntoPro will include the UIE IR database of codes. This database includes codes to control the PACE STB, if only after a fashion. I know this because I have a One For All 6 remote which controls most of the functions of the STB, but from a limited range. What I want to know is whether the ProntoPro will also have the ability to simulate the IRDA codes that the One For All remotes can. If so, I will definitely be buying one.

Teresa

I will be getting an NTL digital box next week (hopefully). This will be the DI4001. "IF" it works with the pronto, would there be any value in me posting the codes to the site?

Has anyone considered the fact that these new boxes should be able to be controlled via some videos. I am hoping that my panasonic video will be able to change the channels for timer recordings. Obviously its not ideal, but the pronto would be able to relay commands via the video into the SCART and change channels. As long as your not using your video to record etc - this should at least allow you to use one remote.

For Panasonic - you need to prefix a channel number with "0" which then gets to relay the command to the attached decoder. (one slight flaw is that PACE do not seem to feature as a manufacturer in the Panasonics manual!).

Regards, Spike

Spike

I for one would be very interested in knowing whether the Pronto works with the DI4001 and if it does how you persuaded NTL to let you have one rather than the standard box. If it works I think I could use the fact that they still havent provided email facility etc as breach of contract, to force them to upgrade the box or rescind my contract allowing me to use ondigital or sky - which is what I should have done in the first place!! :-(

I was thinking of going Digital, and I live in a NTL (Formerly Cobbled & Worthless) area. The thought of having one remote control just for the Digibox is enough to stop me from doing so. However, I contract for Telewest and would like to investigate the possibility of modifying a remote control to map a series of reed relays across the remote control keypad matrix to use the Pronto to control the digibox. The only thing I can think of is the Maplin 15 way remote control unit. But you would need at least 20 or so switches to make the remote any use. Does anyone know of another multi way remote receiver.

Or better still has anyone found a way round this DT1000 dilemma.

On another note, the quality of DTV is so poor at the moment it would be worth getting Sky for 12 months until NTL have got their act together.

A late entry to the sterling work carried out by all on this thread. I have the same probs with digi box.
Letsautomate say that the pronto WILL work with the DI4001n version. I phoned both C&W and NTL. They deny all knowledge of this model code. NTL quoted me DITV1000 plus and the very new one just being distributed is the DITV2000.Are either of these the 4001 by another name?I have little tech know how but want to clear the coffee table like everybody else.