Why are asteroids in the Hemisphere and hemorrhoids on your ass? Speaking of irritating pains in the ass,
Wesley, what exactly is your area of expertise? You are spewing out meaningless buzzwords and cliches and are saying nothing of substance. Not to mention insulting the intelligence of your target market.

Maybe you should contact EIA/TIA, IEEE, and BICSI while your at it.

Ed Shultz, RCDD

Troll.

As you can see Wesley, you have only showed us just how little you know about what we do by suggesting such a ridiculous concept.

Basically, what you have told us is, "I'm going to make this so easy that a monkey could install it"

Do you really think that you can arbitrarily hand some guy a box of wire and he will magically know what it has taken us years to learn?

And before you think that you are going to jump into bed with the big boys (Crestron, Lutron, Vantage) you better get that website straightened out. Let us know if you need some help. I'm sure we could come up with some sort of standard for ya'

On the other hand, I'm sure people laughed at Henry Ford too. Just not as much as we are laughing at you. Good Luck.

oooohhhh....ouch....how'd that feel?

If I really called all the people and companies you site above, would they tell me they're in bed with you and ready to roll out this plan...cause I know several of them, and I'm now interested beyond just this thread....

avdude

Atleast the carol 16-2 will be beautifully documented in the state of the art binders he is planning to create.
Let's see, oh piss on it!

Wesley, you have asked the wrong bunch of guys for an opinion or help. I spend all this time trying to educate builders as to why they should not have the local sparky do integration wiring, and you want to make it a standard.
See ya!

wesley, your standardization prodget will only led to low prices and lower wages. Example in our area electrians(non-union residentional)charge $30-$35 per outlet or hole as they call it. The electrians themselves make anywhere from $10-$20 per hour. The builders now have a salary cap on them. I employ 5 installers and pay from $15-$25 per hour with ok benefits. I charge depending on builder $50-$100 per hole. I'm able to justify the price by presenting fully CEDIA trained installers and 2 are crestron certified. This is the only separation I can have for the builders and my competition(5 in my area). Your standardization would bring me back to $30 a hole and out of buiness soon. I'm located in the Midwest, so don't bash my pricing, you east and west coast installers. I wish I could get what you guys charge out there. Anyway this would be bad for us. The only standard we need in the industry is good, knowlegable, and professional installers out presenting our trade. The home job installer in his ripped jeans and metallica shirt wiring homes doesn't help me to get me and my guys more money. Funny isn't that everybodys goal.

I guess I can commend Wesley's thinking. He's probably tired of seeing all of the BS wiring jobs out there and feels that some major push will elevate the standard. I have beat my head against too many walls to believe this anymore. Builders have sucked me for knowledge by having me do one house and then copying the work and handing it back to sparky... only sparky still manages to f--k it up even with that. They don't want to spend a lot of money... they want to sell a house.

So you send this to every builder in the country at an amazing expense (where the hell do you get the capital for that and what is your ROI). The US Mail keeps up their "standard of excellence" and loses 2 % of your mailings. Another 8-10% come boomeranging back to you because Jed the builder moved or has the wrong address listed. 90% of the recipients throw your lit in the round file and tell sparky to daisy chain the phones and put cable splitters in the wall behind the sheetrock without ever having read your standard. 90% of the remaining 10% begin to read it... realize one paragraph in that they can't understand what the f--k you are talking about and throw it in the round file. Of the few left that actually read it... most will begin to question why they should spend the extra money to put more than the extremely basic package in that is still selling homes.

Lets face it... structured wiring is at best a crapshoot. Most people that have it NEVER open the little white box. All they give a s--t about is that their phones and cable work. How many of you have seen "free" DIRECTV installs where the cable is stapled all over the house with an exterior wall penetration running over the fireplace to the sat receiver when 4 RG6 cables sit waiting in the attic going right to the structured panel. THE END USER IS THE CUSTOMER HERE!!!! Wire what the builder wants and invest heavily in the thickest Smurf Tube that will fit. Watch the house you wired... when it sells, market to the customer (most prewire companies do a really s----y job of following up). It is better to tell the client that the wiring package is basic and you need to do upgrades than to lie and tell them that everything they could think of is ready to go. Get good at retrofit and you'll find that you can charge a bit more in the end without gouging the client and everyones happy.

Good luck with the wiring standard... you've got a long way to go if you believe that it will be adopted and turned into 2005 code... and even if it does... by the time it goes to print, things will have changed and you'll be as obsolete as that splitter in the wall. Just be the best, most up to date systems integration pro you can be and leave it at that.

Wesley, did you used to work for a telecommunications company? The last time I read mindless dribble like this was from a telecomms marketing person.

Your statements, as mentioned above are flawed, as well have no supporting documentation. How can you make generic statements of cost reduction, service improvement without being able to support those statements. You can't! I doubt that this standard is based on a complete business plan.

Do the math, your concept doesn't work. To achieve major cost reductions, as you have mentioned, you need to have a quality control process in place. That's how any manufacturing organization is able to achieve true cost reduction goals. I've seen the work of most electricians (there are exceptions) and it's all about banging in the wire as fast as possible (who cares about bend radiuses ...etc.). Most electricians aren't into continuing education and those who are have probably made the move into the custom installation business.

The only way a builder can reduce costs, after he has sourced the cheapest products, is to throw quality out the door. They get the carpenters with the chain saws because they're faster than the guys with table saws and circular saws (I've seen the build quality from the chain saw gangs, yikes).

I can only speak for myself, but I'm not in the business of building Yugos. Part of my business model and a selling point is quality. You can always find somebody cheaper than me.

Interesting that Wes hasn't responded. Hmmmmm.

maybe he's NDBEER trying to sound intelligent?

I DON'T KNOW WHY I TRY TO HELP YOU LOSERS!!!

Wow! I didn't even know NBDEER (or NDBEER) were still around!

Why are you so upset? AHL was apparently talking about ND, not NB, the different between which has been pointed out in the past.

Is that helmut outta business already?

Wheres the replys? Someone should call his office!