I just had a "DUH!!!" moment. I'm doing this tomorrow. I don't make mistakes anymore when pinning out either way while hooking up a device, but it makes way more sense to do ALL of them at once so you're not ending up with a "spare" that was pinned out differently laying in the bottom of your tool bag.

You're a funny guy. You are telling me that every soldered DB9 connector has been pinned out right? I can't believe that even you believe that. If you are going to get it wrong with the adapter, why will they get it right with the soldering iron? Seems like bad thought process to me.

To me the adapters allow a clean neat setup for little time input, and allow the wire to be used for other purposes. This is more efficient in terms of money and time.


More misinformation. There is nothing in the RS232 specs that say things won't work over 50'. What is even worse, is you say Serial Communications. RS485 is serial communications, and blows your 50' out of the water.

[Link: arcelect.com]

You even discuss RS485 later in your response, but fail to address that it will work over longer lengths. Seems like you are applying "DirecTV installer mentality". The same mentality where DirecTV installers are told that CCS RG6 will not work, so they attempt to charge the customer to rerun the cable. Those of us who understand why DirecTV doesn't use the CCS, realize that on short runs, it will work just fine. Unfortunately, you are falling into this trap of spouting absolute numbers without understanding when they are valid.



No, they didn't have to be switched to IR... you just don't know the tools to get the job done. I guess this is another situation where the Non-pro DIYer has to teach the Pro! LOL

In such a situation, you could keep the serial communication, for a minimum amount of money, and have a rock solid connection. Two of these bi-directional RS232 to RS485 converters, and for less than $50, you can run the serial data rate up to 115.2KBaud.

[Link: serialcomm.com]

how would you install an RTI XP8 without using Cat5 for serial connections?  Do they make solder on RJ45s? :)

I've been told I'm a funny guy. You strike me as someone who is angry and feels the need to try to start a flame war on the internet in an attempt to prove you are smart. Sad really.

Yes, I have not had one cable pinned incorrectly since we moved to soldered connectors from RJ to DB conversion connectors. I don't really care whether you believe me or not. You have a right to your opinion and I have a right to mine. I know what I have seen and have no need to prove myself to you. As to your question of why soldering would be more accurate than pinning out an adapter I will try to explain in a way that you may understand. When a guy has to solder he will not grab an adapter off the van or out of his tool bag that may be pre-pinned. Unlike Stamp our guys dont sit down and pin out adapters ahead of time and mark them. Since they are forced to solder a connector they know what wire is on what pin and make certain they get it right every time. If I ask what color wire is on pin 2 they can tell me. I can double check them if needed. I can have them build the connector as I want it with thumb screw posts or simple screws for securing the connector. I have fewer connection points as well. This has worked for us where the RJ to DB connector did not and resulted in many wasted hours of troubleshooting. I don't really care if you approve of my process or not. It really is none of your business.


This is a personal opinion and applies only if the adapter is pinned correctly. When it is not then it is a huge waste of time. The same can be said for a solder on connector but I have experienced fewer mistakes when a guy has to actually think about how he is pinning out a cable. Not every installer is as organized as Stamp. Those that I have dealt with found it easier to learn to solder than to remove pins from a RJ to DB adapter. Pins can be broken, which the installer may or may not notice. IF this happens then it just increases the troubleshooting time. I stated a personal opinion about soldered connections. I stand behind MY PERSONAL OPINION that they are a better connector.


You really are a hostile individual. Anger management should be in your future. I didn't address RS-485 or RS-422 as the title of the thread is "RS 232 for Dummies". Considering the title I tried to keep the response simply and with guidelines. Had you bothered to read my follow up post you would have noted that I corrected myself. I have read the 50' length in many places on the internet and in books. I misquoted spec. It happens, people make mistakes. I corrected myself. Why such attitude? While I may have made a statement that was wrong it was not damaging. I have experienced many situations where RS-232 worked fine at 200 wire feet and times when it didn't work at 30'. Of the times it didnt work correctly at low wire feet count it was always a CAT cable. The longer lengths were of true serial cable. Even then I have had a few issues crop up at 65' of true serial cable at 2400 baud. Having a wire length in you mind, whether true spec or not, is a good thing for someone just getting started with serial communications. Telling a newbie that he can run a wire for 200' and have it work only to have him do this and it not work is going to cost him money. With thousands of systems under my belt I will always follow my experience and spec a system with RS-232 runs of less than 50'. IF I need to go longer than that I will add the appropriate gear to extend the length. Generally speaking we always spec in a separate processor for remote serial devices. We then communicate TCP between the processors.


Again, this is not a discussion of RS-485 or RS-422. I tried to keep things simple since the post title is "RS 232 for Dummies". I mentioned it casually and in my follow up post I corrected myself. How you draw a comparison to RG6 and a DTV installer with my mistake is grasping for straws. My guess is that you simply wanted to try to insult me further to make yourself feel like a bigger person. Hope it worked for you. I find your argument to be childish at best.


And this is why you are a non-pro DIY... "and for less than $50". The actual cost would be much greater than $50 once you figure in the time it takes to order, ship, postpone the job, piss off the client, more install time that has to be eaten, rolling a truck to a job again, etc. Look man, sometimes you have to get the job done in the amount of time alloted and within the budget allowed. IR conversion was a solution that could be implemented onsite and still kept us on target for budget. You haven't taught anyone anything, other than the fact that you have a need to try to insult people on the internet. Based on your DIY comment I would assume that your tactic is to try to prove your worth in this forum. I personally am not impressed. Yes, converters could be used. I could have converted to IP or implemented a fiber solution as well as the RS-485 converters. I could have delayed the job by many days to do this and postponed having a working system for the customer. Did the switch to IR instead of RS-232 make a difference in the operation of the system? Not to anyone but me, the programmer. Typical of a DIY person you think of solutions without basing them on real world working conditions. Pros have deadlines and promises to keep. As a DIY you have all the time in the world to tinker around with a system until you get it right. You have no money on the line outside of your own wallet.

This is somehow a mystery to some end users/DIY guys. They forget how much time they spend tinkering because they don't realize that this industry is work to those of us who do it and not just a fun thing we do on the weekends whenever we feel like doing it.

A $50 part is not $50.

Its $50+shipping

Plus the employee required to engineer the system and research the available products and choose the part.

Plus the employee required to order and receive it.

Plus the vehicle required to drive out to the clients home.

Plus the employee required to drive the vehicle and install the part.

And that all assumes that it works when you get it there, and a day later and a week later and so on and so forth hoping that you dont have to roll a truck to uninstall it, send it back in for replacement, wait for the replacement, roll a truck back to reinstall it and play this game again.

The "bending over" of the client on price for hardware with margin used to cover that expense. It doesn't anymore. So now we sit here playing Russian roulette as we engineer systems wondering what company isn't being honest about their new products this time around.

I for one cant wait until all hardware is available at ebay and amazon and we just bill hourly for everything we do.

has anyone else used the BTX Maxblox from planetwaves website? We have been using them and I really like them.

[IMG][/IMG]

Oh... I am crushed. You don't love me. How will I go on!

I see lots of misinformation here. When I see it, I correct it. Sorry if that is tough for you to take.

I have used this product several times as well as the Catx solution that someone is trying to get others not use. They work fine just like the Catx solution.

Anyone can miss-wire a soldered connector, as well as do a cold solder joint, and have the connection fall apart. I have also seen this once or twice in my career, well OK, maybe several dozen times... Back in college they had us solder all kinds of crap, and back in the day I used to have to solder on all the AudioQuest ends because all our cables had to be "custom" even if they were standard length... Use what you feel comfortable with and what works for you. I am done sitting behind a rack breathing in solder all day long.

*Yawn* Whatever man. Whether you are crushed or not has no effect on me. I could really care less how you feel.

Correcting information can be done without acting like a typical 13 year old internet troll. What should I expect though. I left RC many years ago when the DIY crowd showed up from AVS. Every one of them responded in your fashion. 'Ooohhhh, I can start a flame war with a pro and attempt to prove my dick is bigger'. It bores me and makes me walk away from forums where your kind linger. Here's a tip, you can be polite on the internet. I know, I know, it's hard for you to believe that is possible. It can happen. I have witnessed it in many forums, including this one. I mean honestly, what purpose did your post to me serve? Is it not possible that you could have simply responded with "hey, I think you have this wrong {quote some spec or website or whatever}". You act like I was being unwavering on the information I posted. I pulled that info from out of the catacombs of my mind in an effort to steer someone in the right direction. Responses from others were polite and corrective. I retracted my information with a follow up post. There really is no need to act like a poo flinging primate is there?

Guess you have yet to discover sarcasm.


I've reread my comments, and honestly don't understand how you feel so attacked. In my comment where I talk about the DIY'er having to teach the pro, I even used a LOL... but I guess you were seeing red at that point. Didn't mean to anger you.

At no point did I attack you. I did however point to what you said, and state with facts that I backed up, why I saw them as wrong. There is a difference between me stating that your statements are incorrect, and attacking you. You have however made numerous allusions to me being a "poo flinging primate", "...prove my dick is bigger", and other comments in the earlier posting. I get that you feel attacked because I corrected you, and since you see my points, you are on the defensive. But you are the one flinging the comments of a 13 year old, unless you want to attribute "poo flinging primate" to a 14 year old.

So, I'm just going to agree to disagree with you on this one. I haven't soldered an RS232 cable in over 15 years. I use the small RJ45 to DB9 adapters, as I like the flexibility, and ease of use. I think running CAT5 or 6 for serial works fine. In the few instances a problem arises, it is easily fixed by pulling a few bucks worth of gear out, that is the kind of stuff I have laying around for just such occasions. I think the flexibility of the networking cable outweighs the small downside of when it is used for RS232.

Just accept that Stamp and techs like me who do not care to solder on 232 connects are lazy and you are a poo poo thrower for stating facts.

I use the RJ45 method as well. I can correctly terminate an RJ45 end in about 30 seconds, and pinout the RJ45-DB9 adaptor in about another 30. While I am pretty good at soldering, there is no way I could match these times with setting up the iron and all of the other nonsense that goes along with it.

The argument about incorrectly pinned RJ45 adaptors doesn't hold water only because it also holds true for soldered DB9 connectors. A lazy, or uninformed tech can screw either one up equally.

Ok, so you guys have been talking about terminations and mistakes...
I'm very new to RS-232 but what I've been doing in the few jobs that I did do is to take the loose pins from the connector like Stamp posted  and just plug them into the receiving component. Once I verify that the communication works, I pull the pins out from the equipment one at a time and plug them into the socket. I have never screwed up a connection yet doing things this way.
BTW, I have had issues where manuals state that their pinout is null where it's actually straight. I talked to one MFG that told me that they meant the connection on the other side, not theirs... Whatever. Doing things by loose pins first ensures that even if my RJ45 pinout is screwed up, I'm guaranteed a good connection.
NOT that that's an excuse for leaving wrongly terminated RJ45 end that way.
If you do that, Murphy's law states that the RJ45 cable will need to be replaced 2 days after you forget that the current cable was "custom" pin-out'ed and you'll have a non functioning system :-)

Sorry best buy didn't hire you....read a few more books from amazon and try again.....I too am not impressed

Holy cow.

I was attracted to this forum because it appeared to be populated by professionals....

Really, flinging insults over preferences on terminating serial communications?