I just recently bought a Harmony and I think it is great! I have Tivo, so I had to spend a lot of time "configuring" it. However, I talked to Harmony and they are working on having a better Tivo configuration out of the box.

In any event, I disagree with the statement that the small number of keys cause a problem with Tivo. This is true with the default configuration, but if you configure it right, its a dream. This is what I did:

When you go into Tivo it puts you into a normal TV channel mode "SURF". The LCD shows the list of channels to go to and the 5 directional control buttons do what the normal tivo remote does: guide, banner, last channel, other tunner, and Tivo menu. The play button shows the time bar at the bottom of the TV screen and puts the remote into "PLAY" mode, which now has the same buttons function as FF,RW,PAUSE,PLAY. The stop button sends you back to "SURF". While in SURF if you bring up the guide it puts you into a "GUIDE" mode where the buttons navigate the guide. Hitting play selects the program and sends you back to "SURF". The help button would just send you back to SURF and remove the guide from the screen. Using ZAP for Tivo on the "SURF", "GUIDE", "PLAY" modes brings up the Tivo Menu and turns the keys into directional functions. This is the only point where you must be careful. I mapped the play button to just do an enter, which leaves you in navigate mode. I did this since this just seemed the best place to have the "Select" function key. But it is a problem if the "Select" button causes a show to start being played. For this reason, I mapped the "Help" button to take you back to the "PLAY" mode.

I am now able to use the remote without ever looking at it (unless I want to jump to a particular channel). I can do it all from "feel". Thekeys are all in an intuitive place, no to mention being labeled with the actual function they perform.

I have sruggled with Tivo/Harmony, so I am interested in your solution. But I am not sure I understand it from your description. Here are a couple of simple examples. Can you fill in what you press on Harmony for me to compare?

Situation A: While watching a recorded program I want to fast forward through ads.
On Tivo remote I press: Fast Forward
On your Harmony you press: ??

Situation B: Near the end of a show I want to stop watching and delete the show.
On Tivo remote I press: Left arrow to get menu, then down arrow twice to highlight "Delete", then select, then select again to confirm delete.
On your Harmony you press: ??

Thanks in advance for the clarification.

Keith

Situation A:
When selecting a program to watch I press the center button (Play) and then press the Help button to switch into the Play mode. Then the keys operate the same as on the Tivo for fast forward, rewind, pause etc.

Situation B:
I press the "ZAP" button to get back into the Tivo menu mode and then navigate to delete. However, that is personal preference. Another option would be to remap the STOP button (which is meaningless in PLAY) to send the left IR and switch into naviage mode. This would let you send the down down enter sequence, which puts you back into Tivo menu with navigate keys

Thanks for the info.

However, my opinion is that your solution just proves that there are not enough physical buttons. Take Situation A. While watching a program the Tivo remote gives you a dedicated set of program navigation buttons (FF, REW and so on). So, only one key press is needed to (say) fast forward. You have to press three buttons to do the same thing. This may not sound like much of a hardship, but notice that the only reason for the extra button presses is to change the mode of the remote so that the single pad of keys is mapped to program navigation.

I accept that all practical remotes need to have mode change commands that remap some buttons to a set of functions (otherwise, to have a dedicated key for every function would require 50 or more keys and the remote becomes big, unattractive and difficult - or impossible - to learn to operate by feel only). The full spectrum of possible remotes includes ones with from 50+ physical buttons down to ones with only 2 physical buttons. At one extreme, there would be 50 to 60 keys each dedicated to one function - and no remapping. At the other extreme there would be one button and a second one to remap the one button to the 50+ functions you need to perform - involving a constant, massive number of key presses to remap the one button to the right mode so that you could press it once.

Of course these extremes are both silly. But the question is - "Where on this spectrum is the ideal place?" In other words what is the optimum balance of physical simplicity (fewer buttons) and power (less mode switching). My answer to this is that when you are in any particular mode you should be able to do all the common things in that mode without changing modes. Changing modes should be restricted to situations where you are logically changing modes (like going from watching a program to choosing programs to record) or are doing something that is done infrequently.

In my case, while watching a program on Tivo, the most common thing I do is some sort of navigation within the program (FF through ads, rewind to watch something I miss and so on). That's why I want a dedicated set of buttons to do those things. On the Tivo remote I can do any of these things in one press. Your setup requires three presses - because you have to change mode to map the direction keys to program navigation.

Your setup is the latest of several I have looked at based on my principles - in every case my conclusion is that the optimum balance of fewer keys and minimum mode swhitching requires more keys than Harmony currently has.

One final thought. When I go on vacation I have to show my house sitter how to operate my AV setup. It is difficult enough to tell them how to operate the Tivo remote where the instructions are "when you want to skip some ads just press FF". Imagine how difficult it would be if I had to say "when you want to skip some ads just press Play then press Help then press FF". I don't think they would get to watch much Tivo!

If Harmony meets your needs as it is, I'm happy for you. But if, like me and several others, you can agree that it is a potential breakthrough product that needs significant change to fulfill its potential, then join the "give us a few more buttons" pressure group. I'm sure someone is going to do it soon. The only question is, will it be Harmony that gets what the mass market wants before somebody else steals their good stuff and add the extra direction pad?

Regards, Keith

[Link: remotecentral.com]

'nuff said

Actually I think remote layouts are a very personal thing. What one person likes another does not. I like the current Harmony and don't like the new one mentioned in the above link (too many keys). The way I use my system, I really only use 9 buttons: volume up/down channel up/down and navigation buttons. Would it be more intuitive if the Harmony had both navigation and vcr buttons? yes. However I kind of like having just one set for both since its less buttons to find without looking at the remote (something I hate to do while watching).

Again its a personal preference but this is my fourth "multi-component" remote (on this system... I actually started with the GE remote in the early 80s). The first one was a RS one with a key for everything. I liked it, but hated having to look at the unit and then try to figure out which key did what. The second was a Pronto which was great except that I had to look at it to do anything more than volume or channel changes. Even that was hard. The third one was a Tivo remote which was great except it did not control the other components.

By the way, I do leave out the Tivo remote for the kids to use. But that is because I rather have them break a $30 remote than a $200 one