Anthony, my price list says the SRP on the Fujitsu is the same as the 777 InFocus. But you won't believe what dealer cost is on it? Ummmm, hello - Fujitsu - anybody home?

I thought the Infocus was 30K

here is the info from Fujitsu [Link: plasmavision.com] so it is 25k

anyways, the guy came back and said he made a mistake, so it was not reduced from 25k


don't know what it is, but I guess not what you want :-)

I love the DLA-HX1 (now the HX-2) and I use them with the Stewart Greyhawk screens and itn looks great.

My mistake. I just looked at the price list and you are right - $25k list. But dont be taking a drink when you read the dealer cost. You'll short out your monitor...

I am not a dealer, so don't think I will ever see it

I used to sell many DILAs. But once the 1280x702 dlp's came out - with dramatically better black levels than the DILA's - I never looked back. Yes the HX1 is a decent piece, but why support JVC's "fog a mirror" distribution policies, when you can have a better PJ like the Dwin for similar money?

I remember a demo once with with William Phelps' calibrated DILAs in Long Beach (EHEXPO 2003). They looked pretty good, then Dan Miller brought in his Marantz 12S DLP and it just stomped the JVC. I mean stomped it!!! Black levels just smoked the Phelps DILA and the picture was so much more 3D. And no I was not drinking.

So I fail to see one reason to support the DILAs when you can sell a 1280x720 dlp (unless you're bothered by rainbows) - and pick one, they all will out perform the DILAs (except for the $30k HD2K 1920x1080).

Sorry, as far as DLP and image quality...
I see the little "dimples" or "halos" in the pixels of ALL of the sub $20K DLPs I have seen, and they make the picture two dimensional to me.
The D-ILA and Sony SXRD seem to be considerably more filmlike, adding a depth to the image that only expertly tuned CRT projos (or actual film) can best.

I am sick of the "black level" argument, I prefer a picture that has more than one shade of black, even if it doesn't represent the very deepest shade... I use the D-ILA with GrayHawk (or Draper's AT Grey) I love the picture quality of this combo.

To me, choosing solely on blacks is like dismissing the finesse and refined character of a high end monitor speaker because a cheaper tower model has more bass response.

Also, every customer may not see rainbows instantly, but the eye fatigue of a color wheel based system IS a real factor over the time of a few movies of a long sporting event.

Plus I think that the additional moving parts, especially the color wheel that also whines like a damaged flyback transformer, diminishes the reliability of this big ticket item. I know that Sharp and InFocus DLPs have been failing like crazy, and I can't imagine the others are too much better.

What is the pricing on those Projection Design Projectors?
Thanks

Was it a Dreamweaver 2 or a Dreamweaver HD2 Plus.
I have only seen dreamweaver 2's with this problem,

I have to tell you that know one has better customer service than Dreamvision, they fedexed me a replacement projector even before I had the chance to box up the defective one. Every time I have called them 95% of the time I get right through to a tech, these guys rock.

Most of the other projector companys you are on hold forever, or you have to leave a message, somtimes they dont get back to you for 2 days. for instance Benq wont do cross exchanges and they want their dealers to pay full retail up front for a loaner as a security deposit while they fix your old project which last time took them almost a month to repair.

Well I for one am tired of the dimple and rainbow arguments. The dimple dithering, and minor decrease in pixel aperture (DILAS have about a 1-2% advantage in pixel aperture) is a NON ISSUE at normal viewing distance, which is 1.5x screen width.

I have logged over a thousand hours – many 3-4 hours at a time - and never has viewing fatigue been an issue to me.

I sold my first DILA (a Hughes G10) in 1997 or 1998 and it was the bomb then. Sold many more over the following years. There was nothing like it at the time, despite all its shortcomings (severe shading or white field uniformity problems, big, heavy, extremely noisy and very tough to calibrate to D65).

How anyone can dismiss the black levels (but more importantly the ass whooping contrast ratio that DLP has over DILA) amazes me. That difference CAN be seen from any viewing distance. And if you put up a convergence grid one can see how out of convergence DILAS are most of the time (granted, 3 chip DLPs suffer from this too). Also I don’t have to spend a thousand dollars on a Phelps calibration to get a DLP to D65. But I guess that is not important either (just like black levels aren’t important- yeah right). ANd that is what improved black levels bring to the table, the abity to see shadow detail without having to turn all blacks into gray.

But most importantly, I am amazed that custom install dealers support JVC. JVC’s support for defective PJs is abysmal (or at least it used to be) and their distribution policies are decidedly out of sync (pun intended) with our channel. I say, we as dealers, need to support companies who at least attempt to support our channel and keep a handle on the distribution (like DWIN, Marantz, Sim2 and even the naked emperor Runco).

JVC approached me to become a select dealer for their new $30k 1920x1080 HD2k and I am considering it because they are keeping the lid on this product very tight. I’m just not sure if I can market or sell a $30k PJ anymore. But rest assured, that as soon as DWIN comes out with a 1920x1080 DLP (or any technology for that matter), I’ll swing my support that way in a heartbeat. I have only had one color wheel fail but I've had many DILAs fail.

We as small custom installers need to take a stand and have the tea bags to say no to these big box companies who try to bring their products to market on the backs of the small custom installer - and quit looking the other way while they are selling to any body who can fog a mirror.

I agree on the distribution... but as a top 5 consumer electronics manufacturer, they have to keep the wheels turning... It sucks, but that's the way it is.
I guess I would rather take the gamble that I may be shopped rather than the gamble that a manufacturer will actually be there in 5 years.

I haven't dealt with DWIN, but their DLPs look very good to me as far as DLPs go. Back when you sold the Hughes/JVC and their service wasn't so hot, I was experimenting with Runco's and Vidikron's CRTs because they were "custom dealer lines" and the reps spoke of superior customer service.

Waves of horror are going through most of the dealers here who read this that remember those days.

You want to compare service horror stories??
Back in the 90's, the projection manufacturers (or reassemblers) from "our channel" absolutely SUCKED in taking care of the dealers and their eternally worthless products.

I didn't deal with JVC back then, we were on an "anti single lens" kick and promoted CRT as the superior solution to LCD and early DLP and ILA, partially because it was true, and mostly because we knew the satellite hacks and central vac/intercom guys couldn't compete on CRT based projects because they couldn't set them up.

Quick story about service, I had an HX-1 with ONE bad pixel and called JVC... within 3 days there was a JVC engineer on site to look at the projo. I got an advanced replacement RMA the next day. I was told at the time by my supplier that this was rare, but it made an impression.

2nd Rick,

I was also a Runco dealer in the late 90's and remember those horror days with all too much clarity. One of the many reasons that I am no longer a Runco dealer - but only one of the reasons. I feel their products are priced about 40% over where they should be. I actually have no idea how good their support is these days but I hear it has improved. But I still feel that their is no value in their products and they spend too much money on marketing. But the advertisisng machine of theirs, is a runaway train and their entire business model is now built on that. Their dealers expect it. So when a dealer, and subsequently a customer, buys one of their products, you are also paying for that full page add in Playboy- over and over again. Having said that, I do applaud Runco for doing a very good job of supporting our channel.

And when I talk about JVC's poor track record, I am alluding to more recent times (like 3 years ago). Have no idea how it is today. Sounds like it is also improving. I still like the smaller companies like a DWIN, but there are others out there too. Dwin is by no means an exclusive to this. From some of the posts on this thread, it sounds like DreamVision is a company to watch.

I cant think of one problem with sharpvision, in the 7 years ive been installing them. maybe a lamp replacement

I hear ya FP...
It's a good thing that there are so many quality providers of sub-$20K models these days, we can have these nit-picky conversations about picture quality w/out having been forced to accept the policies of the only 3 lines that were available like back in the early 90s.

I may need a good kick in the pants, but I am considering going to Vidikron now that Sam is in charge... They have the D-ILA based PJs which I prefer, and the product is a way more exclusive than the JVC branded models.

Anyone else who remembers the horror days of Vidikron care to remark on the tentative path back into the fold?? successes?? troubles??

WOW - I can't believe nobody mentioned the InFocus 777. Are you all aware of this powerhouse? Check it out...I've seen this baby in action and I can't imagine picture getting any better than this.

[Link: infocushome.com]

How 'bout it?