being that its ir.. does the graphik eye system have a eye somewhere besides the panels on the wall? if not.. how hard would it be to hard wire a eye into one of the wall panels?

Simple, run Cat5 to the box ensuring that all low voltage wiring stays .25 inch away from the high voltage as per spec in side the box. Grab a Xantech emitter, cut off the jack leaving a few inches for splicing latter and break off the plastic shell. Remove the graphic Eye faceplate, hot glue the emitter next to the receiving eye. Crimp the emitter’s pigtail {observing the polarity} on to a couple of the cat5 wires using phone wire crimps. Connect the jack end of the emitter wire to the corresponding cat5 wires on the other end and further, to your connecting block; carefully install the graphic eye into the wall box.

Other wise get your self an Ir Blaster.


Enjoy

gothcha.. thanks.. figuring on using it with a mx-800..

islandlife...

One other note. You MAY need to notch the inside of the plasitc covers to insure you don't cut or nick the emitter pigtail you're about to glue inside.

I found this out the hard way, and it took me forever to figure it out (naturally, the most obvious thing was the last I suspected!)

avdude

The IR pick ups in the lutron devices are very sensitive even off axis by as much as 180 degrees. You may be able to get away without hardwiring an emitter directly. That is unless you are using an RF remote.

im just gonna use the mrf200 front blaster. the graphik eye main unit is across the closet from the equipment rack

OH! I DON'T THINK SO!

If you want to (properly and legally) control a Grafik Eye via IR (Other than by using the IR receiver on the face of the Grafik Eye) you can purchase the Lutron Infrared Receiver (part #GRX-CIR-WH) and wire it to the Garfik Eye using CLASS 2 WIRING (Never, ever Cat5).

There are two major flaws in your advise:

1. Running Cat5 UTP into any electrical box that has 120 volt wiring present in it. The .25 inch clearance refers to Class 2 wiring. Stop mixing Cat5 with 120 volt power lines. It is illegal and dangerous both to your clients and the equipment that you install for them. This goes for all you guys running Cat5 into Spacer dimmers as well as Grafik Eyes. There are many other ways to work around these IR issues without violating the National Electrical Code.

2. Installing a blaster sandwiched between the Grafik Eye and the Garfik Eye's cover can and will damage the Grafik Eye. There's not enough room for the blaster to fit without having to force the cover on. Even a little bit of pressure from the cover over the IR eye pushes down on the circuit board inside the Grafik Eye and causes the connections from the buttons to the circuit board to malfunction. Remember, these Garfik Eyes retail from between $690 to $1,010. I replaced one last year that another AV installer broke by doing exactly what you propose. Not only did he destroy the Grafik Eye, but he also ran Cat5 into the electrical box. Never mind running just the Cat5 into the box, but the blaster had to be spliced to the Cat5 inside the electrical box, too. So now he had this hair-thin wire from the blaster crammed into the electrical box with the Garfik Eye's uninsulated 120 volt terminals. The Grafik Eye barely fits into the box as it is. So, I pulled the Cat5 out and replaced it with the proper Class 2 wire (Lutron even sells their own Class 2 cable just for this purpose. Part #GRX-CBL-346S-500. Available in plenum rated as well). Once you run that control wire from the Grafik Eye, you can control the Grafik eye, or have it control other things besides lighting, using infrared, RS-232, contact closure etc. by connecting the proper interface.

Hmm?

Have you actually read your NEC? CAT-5 is perfectly legal and safe so long as you maintain the legal .25 minimum distance requirement. I have had dozens of electrical inspectors look at my wiring with no negative comments.


If you are not qualified to do Hi and/or low voltage work, hire someone who is.


On a side note, Lutron makes multi gang boxes that have a plastic partition in them for just this purpose. Further they have, or are going to modify the faceplates on newer models so as to provide more space for a hidden emitter.

Regarding box depth, If its a retrofit job, I yank out the old box and install a roomy Pass Seymour grey old work box, this provides for lots of space for the Graphic Eye, those blue Carlon boxes are not worth the effort.


David

20 years electrical experience.

Oh and if Mr. Davidcasemore had read my first post he would have noticed that I said to “break off the plastic shell” of the emitter. This is really simple to do, If you look close at the emitter you will see that the red part is attached to a clear part on the bottom, use a pair of dikes to gently separate these two sections. The emitter bulb inside is very small and easily fits behind the Graphic Eye faceplate. I have never had a faceplate or graphic eye break I am also confused as to your comments about using an IR blaster and breaking the faceplate? An Ir blaster is a box that is roughly 1”X4.5”X3” how could this in anyway be interfaced with a graphic eye other than sitting on a shelf across the room going blink, blink?

Further, I agree with you that there is a lot of bootleg electricians out there doing bad things, however, regarding the emitter wire in the box. You don’t leave an acre of wire in the box, you splice at the leading edge of the metal face. Your emitter wire should only be a few inches long. For every one who is afraid of this, there is a way to avoid this all-together and that is to bring the wire out of the wall and into the faceplate from around the outside edge of the electrical box. The faceplate allows plenty of room for the wire to be routed this way. This is great if it is a retrofit, but the Inspectors don’t like this in new construction as you have a wire just hanging around the outside of an AC Switch Box for no apparent reason and the dry wallers always manage not to pull your wire out before they tape and mud.

Well, if you think it matters, I have 33 years of experience and a Master's Electricians license. Read the NEC? I've submitted proposals to it.

You may want to contact Lutron tech support directly regarding all of the discussions in this thread. They can explain the proper and legal ways to connect all of their products along with the correct part numbers etc.

Maybe you, and the other good people reading this thread, will listen to Lutron.

Sorry I said "Blaster" when I meant "Emitter". Sort of like you saying "Bulb" when I'm sure you meant "LED", right?

Guess I should go plant my "Bulbs" in the garden.

davidcasemore...

I wrote this to another poster in another thread

I have extensive expreience in this area...as I have both Electrical (licensed) and Low Voltage (even more experience, but no licnesing in CO yet)...

I would suggest, in a friendly way...that you re-read this section of the NEC, as it clearly defines the rules for this...

If you contact any of the manufacturers I mention here (which I had to do to win a deabte with one inspector) they will supply you with extensive amounts of information pertainig to this issue!

Further...almost ALL NC and Retro Boxes made today that are more than one gang, have seperating fins mentioned by the NEC installed on them...so not only are all of these devices maintaining the minimum .25 inch clearance, they are ALSO including a hard seperator...

Submssions to the NEC does nothing for me, or most of the people here....anyone can submit anything to anyone!

"You are mistaken. The NEC DOES allow LV and 120VAC in the same box...there is a minimum seperation required of I believe .25 inch from the LV and the Line Voltage, but they are absolutely allowed in the same box when neccesary. Reading your profile, I see you're from California, so that could be the confusion. CA, or your municipality, may have a code against it, but the NEC does not prohibit it, just has minimum distances that must be adhered to.

Examples would be as follows:

Lutron Graffik Eyes
PHAST, AMX and Panja light switches
Some Lutron Devices
Some Litetouch Devices
Some Vantage Devices
Some Crestron Devices
Some Leviton Devices
CasaBlanca Ceiling Fans
Heatilator Fireplaces
Stewart, Draper, Da-Lite Film Screens controllers
etc...

All of these have LV control point right next to line voltage feeds, in the same box.

[Link: ul.com]

pay special attention to Section 725-54(a)(1) exception #2 and 2a"

avdude

Just in case you rather make money than bicker you can run the cat 5 or other wire and tape the wire to the top/side/bottom of the box. Fish the wire out from the prepositioned location and there you have it. People like myself use a utility knife to cut out some of the plastic from the cover to allow more room for the LED once taken out of the case. If you break the cover then you need to stop using a hammer to reinstall the GE cover.

Dave