well, thanks to both of you, but still didn't work. I don't know why

gents, I kept trying till I was able to get it to learn the following code for the Vol- (5000 0000 0000 0001 0010 0011) that worked. it seams like it is a long one but it worked!!! can't get the other button to work though. what is going on??

0000 0073 0018 0000 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 003E 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 003E 003E 0020 0020 0020 0020 003E 0020 0CAC 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 003E 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 003E 003E 0020 0020 0020 0020 003E 0020 0020

Good question, I have no answer. Ruling out some answers:

The working Vol+ from message 7 (and the codes Jon and I generated) all have toggle state 0. This working Vol- has toggle state 1.

The working Vol+ from message 7 (and the codes Jon and I generated) all are single frame repeating. This working Vol- is double frame non repeating.

So what is in common between the working Vol+ and the working VOL- and different from the three I made (The three Jon made don't count because PENG won't keep them, but converts them to 5000 format).

If you just take the clean version and convert it to double frame (repeating or non repeating) then PENG doesn't convert to 5000 format. I wonder what that does

0000 0073 0000 0016 0020 0020 0040 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0020 0CA4 0020 0020 0040 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0020 0CA4

0000 0073 0016 0000 0020 0020 0040 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0020 0CA4 0020 0020 0040 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0020 0CA4

0000 0073 0000 0016 0040 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0040 0020 0020 0020 0CA4 0040 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0040 0020 0020 0020 0CA4

0000 0073 0016 0000 0040 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0040 0020 0020 0020 0CA4 0040 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0020 0040 0040 0020 0020 0040 0020 0020 0020 0CA4

nothing, those don't work either!!!

just wanted to report that I finally was able to get it to work. I kept varing the time I press the original key during the learning process until it finally worked. thank you for your help