I'm trying to move/copy an advanced code to a different device. Is this possible?

ie. I added "video 3" TV code to a button, now I want to move it to CABLE device.

I tried the move, but it moved the original button function instead.

Thanks

Try putting the advanced code on one of the L buttons in the original device. Then remap it from there. There are no original functions on those buttons. Let us know if it works.

Dave

You could also try just programming your EFC
code again on the new key. A little less elegant,
but it takes about as much time as it does to
do a move/copy, and at least we know it works.
The sequence is:

- > install EFC code from one device on the key of another device (nnn=EFC code):

MAGIC** 994,
[source DEV], MAGIC, nnn, [target DEV], [KEY1]

Good work, Cico. That one should go into the FAQ.

Dave

Awesome. That's exactly what I was looking for. Don't even need to do the move.

I'm not sure which amazes me more...the OFA remote or the responsiveness of everyone here.

Thanks!

Let me see if I can boil this all down:

If you attempt to copy a button that has already been assigned a new function by the MAGIC-9-9-4 (key mover) method, the *original* (default)function assigned to that button will be copied instead. (you can't make a copy of a copy.) This also means that a button assigned a new function from an advanced code *cannot* be copied from one button to another. All advanced code assignments must be individually to each button.

Is this right? If so, it would mean that a function that did not show up for the device by default and subsequently assigned via advanced codes cannot be copied to another device. If, for the sake of argument, the volume control could only be gotten via advanced codes, you could not "punch-through" the volume using the key mover method. I guess your only recourse would be to use learning for those other devices.

Someone please confirm this?

[Link: ampersand.hypermart.net]

Well, here's another data point for the stewpot:

I have an OFA 'Big Easy HT', which is a non-learning, five device version of the Cinema 6 and 7. When I installed the device code for my Zenith TV/VCR combo, most functions worked ok, but the 'DISPLAY' and 'PREV CH' buttons set up with their functions swapped.

I didn't have the EFCs (at the time), so I 'moved' the Display key to a temporary location (the Surround key), then moved the Prev Ch key to the Display key. Then I tried to move the Surround key function to the Prev Ch key to have everything working per their labels.

It didn't work, the remote wouldn't let me move a moved key. I tried the same thing with EFCs (once I found them), and had the same problem. It looks as a general rule that a 'modified' key can't be moved.

But I haven't done some of the things David B suggests, such as testing with a key with no function assigned (no LED flash), so there's more to check. And the Big Easy HT doesn't have learning keys, and my Cinema 7 is pretty well programmed to the max so I can't experiment with it too much anymore....

Obviously we all need One-For-All to send us free Cinema 7's so we can fully explore and characterize their every possibility, no? :-)

Response by Gerard J. Pinzone on 02/09/00 14:17.08

> Let me see if I can boil this all down:
> If you attempt to copy a button that has already been assigned a new
> function by the MAGIC-9-9-4 (key mover) method, the *original*
> (default)function assigned to that button will be copied instead. (you
> can't make a copy of a copy.)
>
> This also means that a button assigned a new function from an advanced
> code *cannot* be copied from one button to another. All advanced code
> assignments must be individually to each button.

Unfortunately, that appears to be the case, as I just tested this
out to confirm. I could not get the C7 to copy a key with an advanced
code on it, within the same device (I tried copying the EFC-programmed
key to my SURROUND key, which had nothing on it). Indeed, it copies
the key's original function, not the programmed function.

> Is this right? If so, it would mean that a function that did not show up
> for the device by default and subsequently assigned via advanced codes
> cannot be copied to another device. If, for the sake of argument, the
> volume control could only be gotten via advanced codes, you could not
> "punch-through" the volume using the key mover method. I guess your only
> recourse would be to use learning for those other devices.

You can achieve volume punch-through by assigning the EFC (advanced
code) for the volume of the master device (who's volume you wish to
use to override that of other devices), to the volume keys in all
necessary devices. For example, you have your basic "volume
punch-through", but it doesn't extend to AUX device. Since I had a vcr
assigned to AUX, the volume keys didn't work at all. So I remapped the
TV volume to the volume keys in AUX mode so that the vcr device volume
would change the tv volume. Remember that you can also copy the EFC
(advanced code) of one device to another device set by moving (EFC
programmed) keys between devices.

Response by Andrew Russell on 02/10/00 02:36.43

> Well, here's another data point for the stewpot:
> It didn't work, the remote wouldn't let me move a moved key. I tried
> the same thing with EFCs (once I found them), and had the same
> problem. It looks as a general rule that a 'modified' key can't be
> moved. But I haven't done some of the things David B suggests, such as
> testing with a key with no function assigned (no LED flash), so
> there's more to check.

While I have just tested it this way. It appears the C7 works the same
as your Big Easy, that you can not copy any key a 2nd time, and you
can not copy any EFC code programmed onto a key. Oh well, no big
whoop. At least there are easy alternatives to these small
limitations, and they're all "on the books".

> Obviously we all need One-For-All to send us free Cinema 7's so we can
> fully explore and characterize their every possibility, no? :-)

I think if you put in such a request to OFA, they'll go "Cinema WHAT?
Sorry that doesn't appear to be in our line...". It's been said that
they've orphaned the remote to another company, and I get the distinct
impression from what I've seen that it will no longer be produced.
Perhaps it's just as well, since they don't seem to know very much
about their own remote, given a manual that's only half there and all
this inaccurate information they give on it.... Which is a shame,
because I know I'm not the only one to believe its one of the best
things they made.

Andrew Russell:

I think I have a solution. You originally assumed that you had to use a temporary key to do the swap. However, as we have found out, when a key that has a moved/advanced code assigned to it, the key mover function grabs the original function. Therefore, all you need to do is:

MAGIC**,9,9,4,'DISPLAY','PREV CH'**
then
MAGIC**,9,9,4,'PREV CH','DISPLAY'**

That should work.

Cico:
You said, "Remember that you can also copy the EFC
(advanced code) of one device to another device set by moving (EFC programmed) keys between devices."

What? You mean the key mover WILL move an advanced code or copied button from one device to another? How?

I have been thinking for a while about some of the possibilities with the Cinema 6/7.

1) If you assign an advanced code to a key the original function is still available if you press 'Magic' or 'Setup' and then the button. (Call it a 'shifted button')

2) Advanced codes can also be stored on 'shifted buttons'.

3) When you move a button the original function is always moved NOT the advanced code.

What would happen if you tried to move a button which had an advanced code assigned to the 'shifted button'? I can't think of why I would need to do it but that doesn't stop my curiosity. Would the original button function STILL get moved or would the function assigned to the shifted button move?

I'd like to try it myself daren't screw around with the remotes now that the wife, kids & babysitter know how to use them!

Paul B

> Response by Gerard J. Pinzone

> Cico:
> You said, "Remember that you can also copy the EFC
> (advanced code) of one device to another device set by
> moving (EFC programmed) keys between devices."

> What? You mean the key mover WILL move an advanced
> code or copied button from one device to another? How?

Well, the sequence I was thinking of at the time was:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
[SETUP**] 994 [device1] [key1] [device2] [key2]

- > copies the function of [KEY1] from one device (device1 - source
device) to [KEY2] of another device (device2- target device). Hit
"MAGIC" before KEY2 in the sequence if you wish to put the
function to a shifted key.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------


But I tested it and alas, it will not copy EFC keys, like its
single-device-copy alternative - it will only move original keys
between devices. I guess I was thinking of another sequence to
do the EFC copy. Probably this one:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
[SETUP**] 994 [device1] [SETUP] ### [device2] [key1]

--> assigns [device1] EFC code ### to [device2] [key1]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

It's function is to allow you to transfer an EFC-coded key from one
device into the key layout of another device, but you have to manually
enter the advanced code.


> Response by Paul B on 02/10/00 22:00.33
>
> I have been thinking for a while about some of the possibilities with
> the Cinema 6/7.
> 1) If you assign an advanced code to a key the original function is
> still available if you press 'Magic' or 'Setup' and then the button.
> (Call it a 'shifted button')
> 2) Advanced codes can also be stored on 'shifted buttons'.
> 3) When you move a button the original function is always moved NOT the
> advanced code.
> What would happen if you tried to move a button which had an advanced
> code assigned to the 'shifted button'? I can't think of why I would need
> to do it but that doesn't stop my curiosity. Would the original button
> function STILL get moved or would the function assigned to the shifted
> button move?
> I'd like to try it myself daren't screw around with the remotes now that
> the wife, kids & babysitter know how to use them!
> Paul B

You mean you're putting your wife, your kids and your babysitter
*before* your Cinema 7?? [Talk about your screwed up priorities.....]
Anyhooo, I tried it out for you using an EFC code for the shifted
fucntion. The answer is that the shifted EFC function does not copy.
It appears to work only under the same laws that govern a non-shifted
key copy.

Cico:
Ok, that makes more sense. However, the notation that seems to be prefered (since the first device key push can be omitted if the Cinema 7 is already in that mode) for this to be given as:

[device2] [SETUP**] 994 [device1] [SETUP] ### [key1]

--> assigns [device1] EFC code ### to [device2] [key1]

Now, remember all that hubbub regarding clearing a shifted key? The sequence you gave was:

[SETUP**] 994 [key1] [SETUP] [key1]**

The point is that all this may do is copy back the original function of key1 to SHIFT key1 rather than freeing up the memory taken by an advaced code assignment. I say this because all shifted buttons are programmed by defualt with the same function as the non-shifted button.

The only real way to test this would be to bring a C7 to an out of memory condition with a shifted button already programmed, then attempt to clear a shifted button, and then try to assign a non-shifted button with an advanced code or key mover. If your sequence does indeed clear our the shifted button, then the above steps would be successful.

Any volunteers? :)

> Response by Gerard J. Pinzone on 02/11/00 14:53.47
>
> Gerard:

> Ok, that makes more sense. However, the notation that seems to be
> prefered (since the first device key push can be omitted if the Cinema 7
> is already in that mode) for this to be given as:
>
> [device2] [SETUP**] 994 [device1] [SETUP] ### [key1]

Ok, that makes less sense. I don't mind if you prefer a different
notation to the one I described, but I feel I should point out that
your version won't work.

> Now, remember all that hubbub regarding clearing a shifted key?

Hmmmm.... vaguely....

> The sequence you gave was:
> [SETUP**] 994 [key1] [SETUP] [key1]**

> The point is that all this may do is copy back the original function
> of key1 to SHIFT key1 rather than freeing up the memory taken by an
> advaced code assignment. I say this because all shifted buttons are
> programmed by defualt with the same function as the non-shifted
> button.

What the sequence does is remove the advanced code assignment from a
shifted key. That frees up the memory taken by the advanced code
assignment. The result is that the shifted key reverts back to its
original function, which as you say, is the same as the normal-mode
function. I can't find any reason to think it would also, at the same
as it is removing the bits from memory, it is adding a 2nd
"overlapped" copy of the original function to the key's shifted mode,
which presumably can not be cleared by standard protocol. Maybe if I
thought about it long enough... Er, no, it doesn't make sense to me
that it would perform two assignments when you've only asked it to do
one, or that a single key would hold 3 copies (if not more) of the
same function in the memory bank, unless it's being programmed with a
macro sequence.

But in the name of science and the hordes of C7 owners out there that
might be concerned about this and perhaps hesitate to program a
shifted function on account of this concern, I did test the theory
out, as I happen to be very close to maxxing out my C7 anyway... I
followed the instructions you described to test it out (after making
sure I could no longer program a code into my C7), and had no problem
assigning an advanced code to a non-shifted button, after clearing out
the key with the shifted EFC.

Gerald said: "Let me see if I can boil this all down:".

I'm still waiting. Back in the old days, "boiling down" meant reduce or condense.

Dave ;-)