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The following page was printed from RemoteCentral.com:
| Topic: | I AM FURIOUS! This thread has 72 replies. Displaying posts 46 through 60. |
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| Post 46 made on Sunday March 19, 2006 at 14:14 |
CCD Super Member |
Joined:
Posts: | August 2005
2,731 |
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On March 19, 2006 at 12:43, graffixjones said...
Well, this is my first post, so I'll try not to
embarass myself my first time out. :)
This is a really touchy issue, and being that
I'm both a consumer, and someone with a bachelor's
degree in Economics, I can see both sides.
However, what really bothers me is a lot of the
venomous sentiment on the supply side of the chain.
Anybody who purposely lies or misleads a consumer,
simply because they're shopping around for the
best price, should not be in business in my opinion.
Actually, if you keep lying to customers, you'll
find that business will dry up before too long,
and you'll only have yourself to blame.
For instance, here's an example scenario:
A guy comes into your business, asks a few questions
about home theater, then tells you that he will
probably be shopping on the internet for stuff
because he really doesn't have the funds to buy
locally. The reason he has come to you is because
you're supposed to be the local 'professional',
and he respects your position and wants to get
'good, solid' advice. But, at the mention of
the word 'internet', you go into deception mode,
and simply tell the consumer half-truths or outright
lies, because you refuse to point them in the
right direction if you, personally, are not going
to get their sale.
So, armed with your deceptive advice, the person
constructs their home theater. Now... who do
you think they'll be telling about all the 'help'
they received from you... 'other' potential customers.
Only, if those other potential customers are
more tech-savvy than the one you gave erroneous
advice to, they're going to see just how slipshod
your advice was, and any potential sale (from
them) will vaporize into thin air.
In other words, you're cutting your own throat,
because word-of-mouth advertising carries about
1000 times more weight to a potential customer
than anything they see on TV or hear on the radio.
And if someone experiences a botched install
based on your lies to a customer, you can rest
assured that they'll tell everybody they know
not to shop with you because your advice (and
probably installation skill as well) sucks.
The professionals above that mentioned a tiered
pricing structure based on whether or not they
sold the product to the customer have my complete
respect. THIS is how you handle internet shoppers...
you don't deliberately lie to them out of spite...
you simply make them pay a bit more so that the
pricing kinda evens out.
As Bob Dylan said "The times, they are a' changin'...",
and brick-and-morter stores are going to have
to figure out how to compete with bare-bones internet
sales, and your primary weapons are as follows:
1. Value-add (a customer gets 'more' by purchasing
from you)
2. Tiered pricing for labor
3. Professionals on-call for help.
4. Personal attention.
These things can't be bought online, and most
people I know will pay premium for them. In my
opinion, this is where brick-and-morter businesses
should be focusing their advertising dollars,
on convincing people that while they may pay a
premium over buying something online, they get
far more value (above and beyond the higher price)
in customer service, than they would buying a
gray market item from a faceless online vendor.
As an aside, I don't have a whole lot of cash,
so I bought on ebay (an MX-500). However, I'm
a tech geek and actually find this to be an adventurous
undertaking... so I'm not the type of customer
you'd really want anyway (not much potential to
make money from me after the purchase).
Just keep in mind that the retailer's job is to
try to balance price and value, and if you can't
compete on price, then you have to compete on
value. You can't constantly b*tch and complain
to the manufacturer that they need to 'protect'
you, because really, you need to protect yourself.
Thousands of other retailers can stay in business
without protection, why can't you do it?
The internet is changing the way everybody does
business, and you either adapt, or you find yourself
going the way of the dinosaur.
That's my opinion anyway... I hope I didn't step
on any toes, I just wanted to offer my opinion.
You're welcome to disregard it if you wish. ;) Yeah! I think I will disregard your opinion. That was the biggest bunch of junk I have ever heard. Let's say you set up a biz. We will call it Jones Economics Consulting. By your example it would be ok for a client to come in and get 8 hours of your advice. Then since he didn't really have the budget he could just skip paying you for your time because he may refer someone else to you. Obviously you have Zero real world experience. Go back to Ebay!
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| Post 47 made on Sunday March 19, 2006 at 17:51 |
Tom Ciaramitaro Loyal Member |
Joined:
Posts: | May 2002
7,969 |
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Mr. Jones,
We've heard all that and we understand. We compete with online business at times, but thankfully, not all the time.
The part you complained about was being deceived by the company who didn't want to deal with the internet shopper.
So the deception is the part that bugs us all. We are happy to share expertise with someone who considers it to be of some value. We hope to be able to feed our family by the application of our expertise. When we in good faith do so, and have someone shop all our recommendations on the net, who has done the deceiving? We don't like that. If you tell me up front you are a net shopper, then I can spend a little time if I want and move on when it is time. Don't deceive me by asking for a lot of my time and then running off to ebay.
The manufacturer has a decision these days. OK on the 'net or not OK? OK to consumers or only to installers?? As long as we know up front, we can base our decisions on what to buy on that info. If we are assured that no internet sales are allowed, we put our energy, money and support behind that manufacturer. When they sell to distributors who ship them to net sellers, we feel deceived.
As business people, we adjust to market situations on an ongoing basis. It is in effect, rolling with the economic punches. I think a few guys here just don't like being told they have protection from online sellers and they are not seeing it. Not sure if you picked up on that as the primary issue.
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There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions. |
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| Post 48 made on Sunday March 19, 2006 at 22:55 |
remoteshoppe Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | March 2005
484 |
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On March 19, 2006 at 14:14, CCD said...
Yeah! I think I will disregard your opinion. That
was the biggest bunch of junk I have ever heard.
Let's say you set up a biz. We will call it Jones
Economics Consulting. By your example it would
be ok for a client to come in and get 8 hours
of your advice. Then since he didn't really have
the budget he could just skip paying you for your
time because he may refer someone else to you.
Obviously you have Zero real world experience.
Go back to Ebay! I think you have to give credit to what Mr Jones is saying. After all... if you can't close the deal after spending 8 hours with a potential customer is the problem really eBay? Perhaps you need to heed some of Mr J's advice and better promote your services to pre-qualify potential customers. Welcome aboard graffixjones. I hope you've been lurking here long enough to find that there is lots of great info in most other threads but you got dragged into a bitch session. Right, wrong or otherwise... I hate hearing dirty laundry aired in public.
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| Post 49 made on Monday March 20, 2006 at 00:07 |
str1der Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | October 2003
35 |
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It sounds to me like you're not running your business right. I hear over and over that you are ticked that someone wasted your time and stole your advice. If you're a consultant and not a retailer then run your business like that. If I take my car into the shop and say I need information about why something isn't working they will say it will cost me $$$ for that information. If after that I want to go buy the part myself and install it so be it. If the guy at the shop thought hey I'll just give him bad info so he screws up his car he better be gone when I return.
If your skills have value people will pay for them. I don't understand the complaints with URC. These are remote controls not rocket science. My 9 year old can progran our mx-700. These things are no more complicated than a PC. Do you think you should be required to buy your PC only from a specialty PC shop and pay for their expertise even if you don't need it?
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| Post 50 made on Monday March 20, 2006 at 01:30 |
Tom Ciaramitaro Loyal Member |
Joined:
Posts: | May 2002
7,969 |
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On March 20, 2006 at 00:07, str1der said...
It sounds to me like you're not running your business
right....
My 9 year old can progran our mx-700. Snore......
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There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions. |
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| Post 51 made on Monday March 20, 2006 at 01:32 |
Ernie Bornn-Gilman Yes, That Ernie! |
Joined:
Posts: | December 2001
30,104 |
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I was disappointed to note a glaring omission in both of Eric Johnson's posts:
Just WHAT the hell is URC doing when they take complaints "seriously?" Is that a lot of head-wagging and old-biddy clucking?
How about two examples? Leave out names, just mention the markets.
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A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw |
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| Post 52 made on Monday March 20, 2006 at 01:50 |
pilgram Loyal Member |
Joined:
Posts: | November 2004
5,684 |
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str1der: Call a lawyer, tell him that this law stuff isn't that hard and my kid can handle it but, I need a little advice! Of course I won't be paying you because this stuff is so simple that I can do it myself. Ironically, 30% of my clients ARE lawyers! If you ask them a legal question 'on the street' they send you a bill! Is that the business model that you suggest we follow? My e-mail is in my profile and I do accept pay pal !!
Last edited by pilgram
on March 20, 2006 02:27.
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Every day is a good day.......some are just better than others!
Proud to say that my property is protected by a high speed wireless device! |
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| Post 53 made on Monday March 20, 2006 at 11:38 |
B K'witz Founding Member |
Joined:
Posts: | January 2002
387 |
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I am a lawyer-- My current favorite lawyer joke--
A man asks a lawyer " Can I ask you 2 questions for $500?"
"Sure," the lawyer responds, "What's your second question?"
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"Possession of a Lawyer is nine-tenths of the law" www.kgglaw.com |
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| Post 54 made on Monday March 20, 2006 at 13:44 |
str1der Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | October 2003
35 |
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On March 20, 2006 at 01:50, pilgram said...
str1der:
Call a lawyer, tell him that this law stuff isn't
that hard and my kid can handle it but, I need
a little advice!
Of course I won't be paying you because this stuff
is so simple that I can do it myself.
Ironically, 30% of my clients ARE lawyers!
If you ask them a legal question 'on the street'
they send you a bill!
Is that the business model that you suggest we
follow?
My e-mail is in my profile and I do accept pay
pal !! Yes I do suggest you use that model. I do network consulting. I will give "basic" information to a prospective customer but for anything specific they pay. I don't lie to my prospective customers or give them false info. If I don't do a good enough job of selling my value to them then it's my fault if they don't become customers. I don't expect Cisco not to sell them switches and routers to save my business.
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| Post 55 made on Monday March 20, 2006 at 13:46 |
str1der Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | October 2003
35 |
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On March 20, 2006 at 01:30, Tom Ciaramitaro said...
Snore...... I advise waking up before you're out of business. The point is people are more tech savy than they used to be. Your business model needs to adjust.
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| Post 56 made on Monday March 20, 2006 at 16:16 |
Eric Johnson Universal Remote Control Inc. |
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Here's our policy towards unauthorized sales: We now have serial numbers not only on each box and each product but hidden inside the product itself. Any product that has these serial numbers removed or altered in any way is not eligible for warranty service or technical support from Universal Remote Control, Inc. If you find an internet site that you suspect is unauthorized, please report it to this link: [Link: netenforcers.com]Paste in the link to the site you saw our product listed. Then identify that is a Universal Remote Control product in the text box for violation details. Once the complaint has been authenticated, we will then make the necessary purchase to aggressively track the source of the product and cut off the source of supply. Our dealer agreement provides for "at will termination" of any dealer or distributor engaged in the unauthorized sales and/or transshipping of our products. Within the last six months we have cut off multiple dealers and distributors on both sides of the Mississippi for these kinds of infractions. Best Regards, -Eric
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Best Regards,
Eric |
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| Post 57 made on Tuesday March 21, 2006 at 19:23 |
Vincent Delpino Select Member |
Joined:
Posts: | September 2004
1,818 |
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and smelled bad..long hair, hat and sunglasses...was
dark and raining that day Im sorry in 2006 wtf does having long hair mean? you must be joking.
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| Post 58 made on Tuesday March 21, 2006 at 21:09 |
wire pulling monkey Long Time Member |
Joined:
Posts: | August 2005
100 |
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On March 21, 2006 at 19:23, Vincent Delpino said...
Im sorry in 2006 wtf does having long hair mean?
you must be joking. Vincent, you left out some of the saying..The guy also had a truck that needed a jump start and he had no tools...He was selling the service. If he was to work on my house I would have rather him not. I usually dont judge people by there appearence but in this case I had to. His appearend to me looked as if he had just come from a long stay at a homeless shelter..with no bathing or clothes washing priveledges. I felt bad for the guy but Im sorry...wont let people like that into my home
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I can get 7 RG6 cables and 5 Cat 5e wires in a 1" hole and I saved a ton of $$$ by switching to GEICO www.geico.com |
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| Post 59 made on Wednesday March 22, 2006 at 01:11 |
graffixjones Lurking Member |
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On March 19, 2006 at 14:14, CCD said...
Yeah! I think I will disregard your opinion. That
was the biggest bunch of junk I have ever heard.
Let's say you set up a biz. We will call it Jones
Economics Consulting. By your example it would
be ok for a client to come in and get 8 hours
of your advice. Then since he didn't really have
the budget he could just skip paying you for your
time because he may refer someone else to you.
Obviously you have Zero real world experience.
Go back to Ebay! Hrm... it's too bad you view this as 'junk', because it's all completely valid. So, it seems that you don't value word-of-mouth advertising at all, eh? Being that I worked in the advertising/marketing field for eight years before going back to get my degree in business/economics, I can tell you with full authority that w-o-m will trample any print/radio ad you can throw down... WITH NO PROBLEM AT ALL. You ever heard of 'keeping up with the joneses'? Why do you think people buy what their friends have? Because they saw it on a commercial? No, they buy something because someone they know bought one, and THEY recommended it to them. It also works DOUBLY bad in reverse... somebody has a bad experience somewhere, and they'll tell at least TEN of their friends, whereas most only tell maybe three or four about a GOOD experience. So, you keep calling what I'm saying 'junk', and disregarding me completely (after all, I have only three posts now, I obviously know nothing), and we'll just see how well your business is doing in the future. Oh, and I personally think ebay is fantastic... it's a 'pure' market economy... I guess I'd better go back... :\
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David |
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| Post 60 made on Wednesday March 22, 2006 at 01:17 |
graffixjones Lurking Member |
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On March 19, 2006 at 22:55, remoteshoppe said...
I think you have to give credit to what Mr Jones
is saying. After all... if you can't close the
deal after spending 8 hours with a potential customer
is the problem really eBay? Perhaps you need to
heed some of Mr J's advice and better promote
your services to pre-qualify potential customers.
Welcome aboard graffixjones. I hope you've been
lurking here long enough to find that there is
lots of great info in most other threads but you
got dragged into a bitch session. Right, wrong
or otherwise... I hate hearing dirty laundry aired
in public. Thanks for the welcome remoteshoppe. :) I agree that if they can't close a deal in eight hours and secure a customer at the same time, they're in the wrong business. I know that if somebody spent that much time with me, and GENUINELY seemed interested in my business, I'd have no problem paying a premium to have them design and build my system for me. The interesting thing, is I also happen to be in the advice business, since I'm somewhat of a specialist in Reefkeeping (the fishtank kinds, not the maryjane kind). :) I dole out advice on a daily basis and never expect a thing in return, because I'm viewed as an 'authority' in my neck of the woods... it's my opinion that as soon as you become an authority on something it's in your best interest to act responsibly, whether or not you're making money from your actions. Thanks again... I've lurked here for about a month now, narrowing my remote choices down from a Pronto TS2000, a URC-200 or a MX-500... the MX won, and it's a fantastic remote. I'm very pleased with it. As an aside, are the MX remotes 'gray market', or is that just the URC line?
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David |
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