An other instance of Red State intelligence at work. It might be a better idea were we to nuter North Carolineans to prevent this virulent strain of stupidity from causing any further harm.


This, too, is more complicated than your simple and arrogant forular suggests. I'm not as up on my bible as are Anthony or Tom, but I do recollect something to the effect that Man was given domination over the earth to manage it for other creatures.
Burning down parts of rain forests in order to grow crops that are not suited to that soil is severe problem. Is it not arrogant to presume that Man knows more than God about how an ecosystem needs to function? Everything is interconnected and your God given right to destroy insects also resulted in Bald Eagles inability to reproduce. If Man is the intelligent creature the bible postulates then maybe a way can be found--as there was -- to save an indangered species and have economic growth. One might have to think outside the box or do something that was not from habit. By your logic--or Brent's -- why not continue to use DDT, why not dispose of lead batteries at the local dump, why not flush paint thinner down your toilet? Careless use of fertilizer effects polution levels in water; effects what life survives in that water. It also sucks, Ernie, when the landmarks commison stops the local rich dude from destroying a priceless piece of archetectural heritage. Lots of limitations on freedom, including laws that prevent me from culling out idiots such as those North Carolineans you describe from poluting the human gene pool.


Alan

This article really gives me a chuckle. Some of these boxes do offer lower power states, that only keep guide info and clocks alive when off. My DirecTV HD TiVo unit will power down the hard drive when the unit is put into the standby state. But almost all the electronics in our lives lack a real off state.

Even when I turn off my PC, there are circuits still alive! A simple press of any key on my keyboard will power the unit on again. CRT based TV's have contained circuits that kept a low level current on the electron guns, to give a quick turn on time! I find it funny that the author of this believes this is anything new.

Energy Star is an effort to give consumers a easy to discover idea about how a device is designed, and how it stacks up against competitors. When's the last time the author chose an Energy Star product against a product that didn't have Energy Star certification? I'll bet the author doesn't even know about or understand Energy Star.

In my opinion, that's one of the real problems of today. Journalists who want to pass on information, without doing their homework. At work, I promote people who find solutions to problems. I get lots of employees who hand me problems to fix, but very few who let me know of a problem, and the solution! Most people won't take the extra step, they think they'll be appreciated for finding the problems.

So, 83 cents a month. How horrible. I'll have to choose between an up-to-date cable guide and the prescription drugs that keep me alive.


So, what will happen to greenhouse emissions when we all recharge our electric vehicles? How much electricity to produce hydrogen for hydrogen vehicles?


Lets kill all the British.


Third TVs?? I have SEVEN, they are all remote, each draws approx 5 watts when off. As do VCRs, Printers etc. Probably costs me another 83 cents a month.


And the rich will get richer. Only people that can afford electricity will save money. Kinda like the Bush tax refund, If you didn't pay any taxes you were S.O.L. How fair is that?
2.6 trillion, thats a lot. Of course a some of it will trickle down to the poor.

Seriously, most of the problems the world faces today stem from population pressure. But no one has the guts to address the real problem.

Over the last 10 years the Milwuakee Metropolitan Sewage District has dumped 4.7 billion, YES BILLION gallons of sewage into Lake Michigan. There have been No protests from environmental groups, notably silent was the Sierra Club. Funny thing is the fact that the attorney for the Wisconsin chapter of the Sierra Club sits on the MMSD board.

All this happened after Milwaukee spent 3 billion on a storage tunnel to prevent overflows, Illinois sued Milwaukee for polluting the lake in the 80's.
Chicago's poop don't smell by the way, they just reversed the course of the Chicago river so their waste overflows end up in the Mississippi river!

F---ing hippocrits all. I used to respect those groups but now see them as the phonys they are.

The Sierra Club objected to the fence along the border near Tijuana, stopping it from being finished. I don't know if it ever was. Their reason? The fence would disrupt the local environment.

Instead of a fence, then, we had hundreds of thousands of people tramping through and trampling what the Sierra Club had probably designated as a delicate desert environment, dropping trash -- and poop -- wherever and whenever the had some to spare.

The Sierra Club specifically would not take a position on illegal immigration itself, despite the obviousness of the damage that a year-round out of control crowd would cause.

I have often thought that a wonderful argument against illegal immigration could be summed up by the name of a children's book: Everyone Poops. After all, it is true that everyone poops and that concept would immediately lead to a consideration of the infrastructural demands of people added to the population.

You might (not?) want to read this:

[Link: article.nationalreview.com]

This is one of my problems with being "green" at any cost. Some of the issues & positions that are just "obvious" to environmentalists aren't as simple as they seem.

I'm *not* in favor of raping the planet & nuking the whales, but there is such a thing as the law of unintended consequences & there is no free lunch. Somebody will pay, in this case millions of malaria deaths.

The tree-hugging fringe takes some of this to extremes where it becomes their religion & will cry heresy if you question any of the standard boiler-plate talking points. If you don't like this article/author/source, just google DDT ban. Not exactly a black & white issue.

BTW Alan, seems like you're taking things personally and being *extra* cranky & argumentative lately. Are you OK?...anything you want to share with the group?

The trash can outside our house is next to my car so I generally take out the trash bags when I go to work each day. It may have taken a few years to seep in but I've only recently noticed just how much of this stuff each one of us in our small family generates. It is truly scary that this volume times 300 million is generated in the US alone every day. It really doesn't take a genius to figure out that this consumption level cannot continue unabated without serious ecological or environmental impact.

Add to this the "hidden" consumption of gas, electric, household cleaners washed down the drain, pollutants galore from industry to name a few and it all gets a bit - mmm... scary.

Now I'm no tree hugging hippy but I can't help but at least be a tad concerned from reading an article recently that documented a reporters measured chemical contaminents in his blood and urine. Suffice it to say the article gives one pause. The scariest part was where his measured dose of Mercury was 5 parts per billion, fortunately for him it was only half of the 10ppb that the CDC "recommends".

He returned the following day after two meals, one of swordfish, one of tuna I believe, both fish caught near San Francisco, and had the measurement performed again to reveal Mercury levels of 12ppb not only now exceeding the CDC's threshold but increasing his level 140% overnight. Measurements of as little as 5.8ppb have been shown to reduce a child's IQ points measureably.

BUT! I have a solution to the world's problems.... feed our child molesters, kiddy pornographers and school shooters three squares of swordfish a day, reduce our military budget by ceasing production of our bombs and start dropping trash on any country that doesn't get on board with some good ol' christian values and then give the money saved to teachers that have to motivate our semi-retarded, but very shiny, youth.

Ernie seems to be on a school marm kick these days. One must spell correctly, lord forbid one does not proof read to his standards and in this thread, [Link: remotecentral.com]

he now has taken it upon himself to be the NY Times gramarian and scold upon the proper use of "some times" and "often" ( in a thread about ground loops --so this grammar must surely be relavant!) Of course, its not as if this grammar had any bearing upon the thread, but, Lord, must this nonesense be spewed?

Then we have this tripe about "tree hugging hippies" [nitpickwit], "tree-hugger crowd that always claims to be for the little guy"[Brent] and "the net effect of the leftish sensibilities championing 'conservation'" [Ernie]

Each comment more insipid then the next and each with the same vapid intellectual content as the nutritional value found in strictnine. Meaningless sloganeering now passes for thought. Where is the arrogance that sees no possible value in preserving all life for future generations? How virulent the ignorence that now sees as radically "liberal" and thus worthy of dismissal the most conservative of American values? Would that Ernie paid 1/10 the attention to his history as he does to grammar. Your argument is hardly so porcelaneously absruse. You raise a valid point in the unintended consequnces of human arrogance. DDT may not be the answer to the mosquitoe problem but I'll not dismiss it over quickly. I will suggest that its original use had the unintended consequnce of causing many birds and sea mammals to almost go extinct. Anyone paying attention to the Orca breeding issues that have to do with heavy metals in their body? Better living through chemestry? Does human arrogance no any bounds? Must all life become extinct before we also go the way of the dinosaurs?

I'll grant that I'm a pendant but I like to think I don't trudge useless penantry around. If I suggest that real engineering is required when considering a sub-whoofer in a room one may disagree but I think it a valid opinion worthy of consideration on a board made up of technicians and engineers. Sure I could spell better but isn't it better to pay attention to the main idea that manufacturers might not be constructing their wires according to their published specifications rather than to focus solely to those mis-spellings? Might one expect a literate, well constructed thoughts and, therefore, arguments, as you just supplied in your repost? Might one grow tired, and thus impatient, with the toungue clucking, finger waving drivel that passes for commentary on a site supposed visited by above average intellects? Why is it than when some topic other than engineering comes up evidence of these above average intellects seems to vanish?

I shall express my mia culpas to one and all. I had no idea I had become so strident. Then again, I am generally made impatient when surround by offal.

Alan

I have *got* to get a bigger dictionary.
Making a mental note to *never* play scrabble with you...


Fair enough.


No.


No need need to sugercoat it for me... actually pretty entertaining.
I was just concerned that your overall stress & bile level seemed to be elevated recently.


That reminds me...


I think QQQ has you pegged Alan. That is some funny offal!

It is quite amusing that we of the "under class" never get the consideration given to "fairy shrimp" & "spotted owls".

The only response to any proposed idea's that falls contrary to the accepted druid mantra, is never far from simply being called a dumbass.

More food for thought. Going back to the article, it was also based on the false assumption that energy is a scarse comodity, that is being wasted on conspicuous consumption.

Electricity is not scarce, rare, or are we soon going to run out........except that these same people who claim it's scarce are the same people who continue to impede, prevent and road-block any attempt to produce more. Unlike many of you I spent two years living outside the USA. Most of that time was spent in France, that same France that many lefties use as the Glittering Utopia in terms of health care, and social(ist) policies.

Do you happen to know how that somewhere north of 80% of their electricity is produced by..........(GASP) Nuclear power generators......(double gasp)

If the druids of the far left would stop and consider the big picture.....bypassing the ill-founded pre-concieved notion that all progress must somehow be bad, they could look to more "consevationist" actions, and less "environmentalist" (they are not the same)



btw...... is Bush the dunder-headed moron that daddy had to pay off his teacher to get him through school, or is he the criminal mastermind that started a war so his buddies could make billions, and manipulated the weather to send Katrina down on the largest of chocolate cities!!!

Isn't Bush a dunder-headed puppet whose strings are being manipulated by Dick Cheney in his attempt to take over the planet by drilling the arctic wildlife preserve thus raising gas prices?

And why doesn't Cheney declare his candidacy for president in 2008 so Helen Thomas can off herself?

So, ah....

The cable boxes do run cooler when in the 'standby' state, which is what is usually deemed off. When in the 'standby' state, the hard drive doesn't run, though the box is still consuming some power.

Thereby, with proper discrete codes, power waste will be down to $.54 a month. Which is enought to give a Chinese factory worker a raise. All kidding aside, there is a lot of waste on all these various devices we leave on all the time. The thought of supplying some Islamofas....uh, Islamowacko with an ounce of C-4 by leaving my cable box on for 3 years straight is enough to make me want to buy an MRC400.

This is so much more fun than ragging on URC malcontents, I'm so sorry for leavin. Next time I do, somebody put me in check.

While I insipidly harangue my kids for erroneously consuming ever increasing amounts of scarce power and send vapid comments their way such as "Turn off the lights in that room!" I drive down the crowded route that I must navigate to my domicile and alas, the high rise alongside me, now manifestly devoid of any sign of homo sapiens, has entire floors fully lighted, all computers running....

And I fretted about a 50 watt light bulb burning...