Darn, I was hoping they would go with the button layout from MX-700 instead of the MX-500 while they were at it. I really the Guide/Menu/Exit/Info layout from the 700 better than the 500.

Yes, I know I can set the buttons to act any way I want, but if I want the wife to like it, I'll have to use what the printed labels say.

-Bear

There are certainly proponents of both designs, but the MX-500 style was used because the MX-600 basically is an MX-500, but with updated looks (the silver-ish hard plastic case versus the MX-500's dark-blue rubberish-suede finish) and of course the RF capability. If the buttons were different, then cloning with the MX-500 wouldn't work either. So, it's a personal choice. If you love the MX-700's button layout, and need RF, I have the perfect remote in mind for you (MX-800) ;)

David
www.BlueDo.com

Will the MX-600 work with IRClone?

Yes it will.

I own both a 500 (bought two years ago for my Pronto-hating wife) and a 700 that I bought a few months ago to replace the dead Pronto. I really like both, but find the key layout on the 700 much better than on the 500, so I guess I was really hoping we would see another rev of the 500 when the 600 came out that at least rearranged the bevel buttons to match the 700s layout.

I'd be happy if the labels were in the same place, so it is easy to switch between the two. For example, I'd like to see the record button in the lower left of the MX 500 just be replaced with the Stop button, like the 700. No need to physically move the buttons (and the associated retooling costs.)

Of course, as you say, its a personal choice. Since I just added a new small set to another room, with a satellite and VCR hookup, I just can't justify a $500 remote for it. Now maybe I can convince my wife to move her MX-500 to the new set, and get another 700 to replace it :-)

-Bear

I am happy that URC added dedicated buttons for things like "Guide", "Exit", etc. on the MX-700/800. The dual labeling on the MX-500/600 is not ideal. However I have been very disappointed with the fact that the MX-700/800 doesn't have the ">>|" and "|<<" (Chapter Skip) buttons that are on the MX-500/600. These buttons are important for DVD and TiVo watching and I really wish URC had kept them. My ideal keypad layout would keep all the buttons currently on the MX-700/800 plus adding back the ">>|" and "|<<" buttons. If URC's issue is too many buttons then I would gladly sacrifice "Exit" and "Info", moving them to the LCD buttons instead, if I could get the Chapter Skip buttons back. These two buttons belong around the bezel with the other transport keys, IMHO.

The |<< and >>| buttons have been talked about ad nauseum.

Most everyone uses the CH+ and CH- keys for those functions, or puts them on the LCD close to the bottom.

Ch+ (CHapter skip forward, CHange track forward, etc.)

Works very well and is easy to explain to another user. The |<< and >>| buttons aren't available on all remotes anyway, which means if you had one of those remotes you would have to teach yourself and another user to use another set of buttons, which on a lot of remotes are totall irrelevant. At least the CH+ and CH- buttons can be thought of with relevance, as mentioned above - CHapter skip, etc.

IMHO, as well.

... Greg

The number of threads discussing this topic has been a tiny fraction of those commenting on the MX-700. On the other hand, what has made me nauseous (your words) is the quantity of syrupy sweet threads going on and on about how wonderful the MX-700 is. I also believe the MX-700 has many excellent qualities. I own one (as well as two MX-500's and one MX-800.) I just think it and the MX-800 are flawed by the lack of these two buttons and I think potential buyers and especially URC should both to be aware of the defect.


Of course they do, because that is the best available alternative. That doesn't mean that URC's design isn't flawed. I think it would be vastly superior if URC had simply left the ">>|" and "|>>" buttons on the MX-700/800 transport keypad, where they were with the MX-500. This could have allowed the "Exit" and "Info" buttons to go on the bottom row of the LCD. Alternatively, they could simply have added two more buttons.


I am not aware of any current model DVD players that lack the ">>|" and "|<<" keys on either their remote controls or faceplates. These symbols are international standards. "CH+" and "CH-" are mnemonics that aren't immediately intuitive for anything except channel changing. The whole point of standards and symbols is so that no one needs to explain to anyone what certain things mean.

(We haven't even considered the question of TiVo users, who suffer from not having these two transport keys as well. I know there aren't as many TiVo boxes out in the world as DVD players, but TiVo just announced that it expects to add its one millionth user by Christmas and continues to grow very quickly. Configured as a TiVo remote, the MX-700/800 don't have the CH+ and CH- keys available for chapter skipping; they are required for channel changing.)

In summary, I think the MX-500 is an excellent product. I believe the MX-700 represented a major improvement in many respects, but a non-trivial step backwards in this one particular area. My primary goal in raising this issue (which I will continue to do in the future) is to create enough demand for URC to restore these two keys in a future version.

This message was edited by lhl12 on 08/26/03 06:13.

I really don't see why "CH +" couldn't stand for CHapter just as well as CHannel. :-)

How does one say "Chapter" in Italian, Spanish, French or German (let alone Japanese, Chinese, Arabic or Sanskrit)? I don't know, but I'm guessing it doesn't start with "CH" in each language. That's the whole reason there is such a thing as the ISO and why international standards are symbols, not text. URC conformed to these standards with the MX-500 but then violated consistency with the MX-700.

Also, the point is not that "CH+" couldn't function as Chapter Skip -- it could (at least with DVD's). It's that by using that key for that purpose you are duplicating a single key for multiple functions. This is exactly what URC was (rightly) trying to get away from when they eliminated the use of doubly-labeled keys when they went from the design of the MX-500 to that of the MX-700.

Finally, the "CH+" and "CH-" keys aren't available for use as Chapter Skip with TiVo because that device requires those keys for channel changing.

I hear you, lh, but each and every remote ever made has its pros and cons, and each one of them is generally subjective.

Some say there are already too many buttons on the MX-700/800. Some say just right. And some say the remotes are missing some.

Some of us wouldn't want the Guide, Menu, Info, Exit in any other configuration.

But, you're right. It is a good idea to let URC know of our concerns.

... Greg

To be fair, you should point out that "Channel" probably doesn't begin with "CH" in other languages either, making the "CH+/-" label just as inappropriate for channel changing as chapter jumping. Can't think of any better label for it than the one HTM is using. I just wish the transport buttons had the same layout between the two remotes.

-Bear

Bear -

I agree completely that it would be best if the MX-700/800 had the same transport key layout as the MX-500. This would allow the four Info/Guide/Exit/Menu buttons to go in an area immediately above the transport keys. With this layout, I think the MX-700/800 would be perfect!

Italian? CHapteroni.

French? CHapterre.

Spanish? CHappitto.

German: CHappin se deutsche......... or something similar.

;-)

Greg,

Actually French would be CHapitre...

Martin ;-)