Is there a more usable version of the Harmony software out there?

I've the 7.3.0 thing, and it's just a complex mess of counter-intuitive wizards (which the translation does nothing to improve), and I've been unable to find a way to simply have the TV turn itself ON/OFF when pressing the on/off button, or map the standard buttons to specific actions on specific devices.

Only ways to control things programmatically seems to be with the "activities" but only 4 of them are accessible at once, which is kinda naff to say the least.

Basicly, I just want a "setup mode for dummies", where I pick a button on the Harmony remote, and assign it an action on one of the devices, without having the remote try to be smart and randomly turn on/off devices because it has lost track of what's on and what isn't.

Is there such a mode or software version? Something straightforward like:
- button1 : device/action1, device/action2...
- button2 : device/action1, device/action2...

1. There are only 2 software interfaces and both are very similar:
o client software interface (with built-in browser)
o website interface (http://members.harmonyremote.com/) - You use your own browser.
Note: The website interface still needs the client software.

2. The "Off" button is actually the "Off" Activity. It will turn off all devices that it turned on via the activities by tracking their power state.

3. In any activity, you can map any command from any participating device on a hard or soft key. On the Website interface, the feature is under "Activity > Customize > Change the behaviour of buttons". On the Client software interface, the feature is under "Activity > Customize Buttons". In both cases, click the "Additional Buttons" (tab at top) to customize the custom LCD buttons (soft keys).

4. All Harmony remotes support a lot more than 4 activities. I think the limit is 256. I don't know where the "More Activities" function is on the 525. I think it's either by pressing the "Activities" button repeatedly or by pressing the Left/Right arrow buttons.

5. The Harmony remote is an Activity based remote. You need to familiarize yourself with this concept. Once setup properly, it will track all device power and input states and dynamically send the proper commands to switch from one activity to another. The "Help" button is used to re-sync device(s).

6. I agree with you that the software interface is convoluted. It has quirks and issues. You need to familiarize yourself with it, read between the lines and put your thinking hat on. In many cases, the S/W default option to setup things is to use the original remote. You should ignore that option. The original remote should be used only to teach it missing command(s) or to confirm the IR language (for device supporting multi modes).

You should play around with the interface. Try each tab to find out what they are for and take notes. I prefer the website interface instead of the Client software interface but that is just a personal preference. Try both and decide. Don't be afraid in exploring the interface. Many people get into trouble because they assume the configuration wizards will perform miracles.

You have to use a systematic approach. The 1st thing to do is to get familiar with all your device capability by trying all the commands in device mode paying attention to their action (toggle, cycling, or direct), and documenting their behaviour. The device mode is really a familiarizing/debugging tool.

Armed with this info, the next step is to configure the device power and input settings. Try to use the direct (as oppose to toggling/cycling) method where possible. Many device brands supports discrete (direct) power and/or input commands although they are not on the original remote.

Once you have setup all the devices properly, now it's time to add you activities. Most people do that right away skipping the 1st step (device configuration) and get into trouble trying to fix an "engine (device)" problem through the "tailpipe (activity)". Time wise, you spend it wisely now by exploring, or waste a lot of it later.

Thanks for the hints, after more than one hour of aggravation I had been able to figure some of them, and it was working (kinda) for the TV and audio system... but the thing is darn too annoying to configure, and the remotes behaved in strange ways from time to time (instead of turning on the audio f.i., it would turn it on then immediately off, like it was sending the power toggle command twice).

I'm returning it, not worth the price or the configuration effort IME, and the configuration software is just so aggravating I don't wanna get near that thing ever again.

sounds to me like another device-centric person getting frustrated with an activities-centric remote. They *can* be confusing if the human is device based.

Well the #1 issue is that most of my devices have toggle-based power, and the remote cannot accurately track are on/off, so it sends toggles out, some get missed by a device (for whatever reason, delay, remote orientation...) and sooner or later stuff gets out of sync and you end up remoting a Christmas tree of devices blinking on/off.

This was made even more aggravating because as a user, I knew exactly what device was on/off, and having direct access to on/off for each device is infinitely more efficient than playing guessing games with the remote (especially when there are slow to power up devices in the mix...).

If some people got aggravated like me, here is how I dealt with it:
I've replaced the Harmony with a standard Phillips universal remote with a "learning" button (now, *that* was straightforward to setup), and grouped the devices on/off with RF-controlled power outlets (like Harmony's "activities" I guess, except it works, as my TV switches automatically to an input whenever it gets powered up and activated).

Wrong, wrong, wrong. The Harmony is the ONLY universal remote that can track on/off states of equipment with toggles and ACCURATELY control them.

You just didn't take the time to set up your devices correctly (it only takes a few minutes). The rest of your problem is most likely timing delays which also need to be tweaked sometimes (a one time adjustment).

Sounds like you're the one that couldn't be programmed, not vice versa. Enjoy your manual controls.

Sorry, but no, that's misleading advertisement.
It didn't track squat, it just sent on/off toggle depending on the state it *believed* the equipment was, which more often than not, was incorrect (like whenever a command was missed, see below).


The "it takes a few minutes" is also misleading information, 30 minutes is probably the bare minimum in a best-case situation: must install software, download update, register account, confirm email, start software, go through the convoluted and lengthy wizard, plug, wait, unplug, try, re-plug, modify via convoluted wizard again, wait, un-plug, try, etc.
In practice, if you have a 2-3 devices, 2-3 hours setup time is more like it, and that's assuming you can bear the software for that long.


Actually, I had to tweak the timings with the Harmony, including the repetition. Any el-cheapo universal remotes doesn't seem to require timings tweaking, but the Harmony did.
On default settings f.i., increasing the volume would increase it by two steps, when reducing the repetition setting, volume increase is handled "correctly" (well, 3/4 of the time), but then the on/off signal misses half of the time. And of course the repetition setting is per-device... and you can't define macros (or it was well hidden) for keys in an activity to mimic a custom repetition depending on the command, the only macros were for transition between activities.

IMO it's just a product that was poorly designed both from an hardware (weak IR strength or a very poor quality IR signal) and a software point of view (as user friendly as a DOS command-line, if not less).

Wrong, wrong, wrong. No remote (yet) truly tracks the actual state of a device as was pointed out above (URC is working on this).

Secondly, there are remotes that do what the Harmony does, they just cost more. For instance, the URC MX-950 and MX-3000 do everything the Harmony remotes can do and more. Money not object, I'd have an MX-950 in a hearbeat, it is much much better than any Harmony in pretty much every respect but you pay for that quality.

Wrong choice of words on my part. The harmony does this automatically for you assuming you set everything up correctly. The URC remotes not only cost more but you have to *manually* program them to keep track of the toggle states. The harmony does it out of the box on it's own and it's cheaper.

I'll admit, I almost second guessed my Harmony 880 purchase after having charger issues right off the bat and then after going through the wizard to set up my remote with all the "Automated power on/on and line input settings".

This is the way I see it. I don't think it is device or activity based users, I just think the automation of the power toggle and line input state can be a little hard to setup. It is just too bad so many people have returned such a fantastic remote over a little misunderstanding.

****** LOGITECH HARMONY REMOTE MANUAL FOR ACTIVITY HATERS *********

Personally the way I set my Harmony 880 up, is...now hear me out before you activity lovers freak out. I added all of my devices (TV, VCR, DVD, PVR, Home Theatre and X10 controller) to both of my activitys (Watch TV, Watch DVD). Then I went through the wizard and selected power and line input options so that they do not change no matter what activity I select. This may take a couple of go throughs to get right. Then what I did was add soft buttons (screen buttons) to turn stuff on and off manually. This works very well as I never turn off my home theatre, so I control that from the device option. But under my Watch TV soft button screen, I have A,B,C and Live for my Rogers PVR (only buttons I really use that could not be mapped to hard buttons) , I have a couple of buttons to control my X10 lights, two buttons to toggle my TV and PVR power, etc... I think this is what the rest of us are looking for, cause I initially was not impressed with my Harmony 880, now I absolutely love it.

So long as all of your devices are under all activitys, you can map any device to any hard or soft button. This way all of the functions you need access to while watching TV, you set under the Watch TV activity with no anoying automatic Power/line in controls. If you require more control of a device for a momentary need then you select the device.

But the whole reason most people buy a harmony is because it automatically controls the power and inputs. Most people do not want to manually control the power and inputs - they just want to select an activity and have it magically work. Which it does the vast majority of the time.

Just because you weren't willing to spend an hour or two getting the power and input settings to work doesn't mean it can't or shouldn't be done.

I think one trick for "novices" is to understand that the Harmony only knows the "state of play" based upon what it has transmitted to the various devices.

I know I was getting totally frustrated with my 785 (Australian equiv of the 720) with regards to power on\off and source input settings for my NEC Plasma TV and Panasonic DVD Recorder ..

It switched on the TV OK and worked fine but more often than not when I tried my "Watch a DVD" activity it randomly would not set the TV source to HDMI (signal coming from the DVD Player) ... but sometimes it would ..

The "light in my brain finally came on!!" when I realised that while I was trying to get the 785 programmed properly (connect to PC in upstairs office, run software, configure settings, disconnect from PC, go downstairs to where TV\DVD were located and test settings) over several "test sessions" spread over several days ... I was AT THE SAME TIME still using the original device remotes to actually use the equipment!!

Of course this meant that the 785 might have thought it had switched the NEC TV ON (the last time I used it) ... but I then may have used the original NEC remote to do something else ... so now the actual state is different to what the 785 THINKS is the current state etc ...

Once I realised I needed to really store the orig remotes in the bottom drawer and get the 785 basically working the device state in sync with the devices ... and then add "functionality" bit by bit .. it all started to come together OK ... (Using the Harmony help button on the remote also ensure the sync state was reset OK when needed) ..

While I still have a few teething problems (mainly to do with "Channel Favourites" for the TVs) .. I'm happy to say my 785 is now happily controlling the NEC Plasma, Panasonic DVD Recorder, Technics AV Receiver, GrooveTime iPOD Portable Speakers\Docking Station, DigiCrystal PVR and the bedroom TV (a german Grundig TV) across several "activity" set-ups ...

So the message is ... keep persevering with the harmony ... once it is working OK ... it is a pretty good remote ... and the configuration software whilst not perfect ... does do quite a good job once one masters it ..

GaryW