EJ, I actually paused as I wrote that stataement, becasue it came out like I had all this vast experience with the product dependability. Not what I had in mind. While I have no experience w the product itself, I do with the company. My admitted bitterness towards the company is based on my own personal experience in dealing with them, their lack or normal common decency, conversations wit them, LACK of converstaions wth them, etc. These issues, combined with the fact that it seems everyone has had nothing but failures with the product (except when using for urinal cakes) has led me to not pursue the line. I have taken my efforts, and buy in money (which both are around $5k) to HomeLogic. I am flying to MA next month for training, and with any luck installing my first system that same month.

Frank, my comments weren't directed to you at all. I know your story and to be honest, I am dumbfounded that a company that has caused such a stir (good and bad) in our industry doesn't have a perfect record in at least communicating with dealers and potential dealers. I have never had problems with mine, but I know you're not the only person to have these problems with your rep. To be honest, its ridiculous.



Not everyone


Good luck and I hope someone from C4 is reading this...

So far so good on this end with C4. Admittedly, I've only installed a single system, but once it's up and running it's pretty stable. No major problems as yet.

Tech support has been excellent with the longest wait being 18 minutes (one time only). 90% of the time there was no wait. And as a newbie, I called a lot! I still have to get a better grip on bindings, but otherwise, the system is easy to program.

Dawn

I am doing a job now for this guy, His brother has a C4 system here on the LI (long island). we get talking and then he mentions to me that his brother has a c4 system. I said really, i was going to take on the line but didnt' due to product malfunctions.
Well, that set him off. It turns out this guy has had nothing but problems iwth the system and HATES IT! even the owner of C4 went to this guys house to look at the system when he was in NY recently. All and all when i hear that from a someone who is not in the busienss i stay far far away, esp when the owner of a company comes to someonese house and cant get it working...

I had an issue with them before I came to this site, but the threads here have shown my fears to be true. No I have not installed the products, but before I started my company I hadn't installed a lot of the product that I do now. I tell every potential vendor/manufacturer that I am in the relationship business. I want to have a good relationship with all my reps. I share with them my goals, and hope that they help me reach them.

C4 put on an incredible show at CEDIA. They spent a lot of money traveling the country to show the product to CIers just like us. Then when we all don't jump on board they run to CC? It was 9 months betweent the time that I saw it at CEDIA and the time I saw the road show and a lot of the products still were not shipping!?! I have NEVER received a follow call from the rep after talking at both events. At this point, I don't want to talk to him.

I have been a Control 4 dealer for about 8 months. We have installed a couple of dozen systems, along with a fairly large demo system.

I also have had a system in my home for about 6 months, home theater, lights, distributed audio, security, and I have thermostats on order.

While there have been a few growing pains, the majority of my systems have worked very well. For considerably less then an AMX or Crestron system I can provide a fairly complete control system.

Now to compare it to AMX or Crestron in most categories is foolish. The power and flexibility of AMX and Creston is only really limited by the programmer, while Control 4 is limited internally by the nature of the product. But the price for hardware, and programming, are without compare. You could easily charge 4 times as much for programming as actual to cover any “growing pains” and still come in far below what it would cost to program the other two.

Compared to products in it’s price category. For instance a Control 4 Hometheater Controller sells for the same price as a Hometheater Master MX850 with an MRF250. Programming for each is similar for a small home theater. I have found the zigbee of the Control 4 to be much better then the RF of the Hometheater Master. Also there is the addition of a serial port, contact closure (especially helpful for those cable boxes), video sense, and of course the ability to add a hard drive and get audio management. Now I will admit that the MX850 is a much better looking and functioning remote. Still I have had no complaints from the wife when I replaced it with the Control 4 remote. Also the ability to add lighting loads for $100 each is unheard of.

How about comparing it to Escient. I have sold the fireball in the past, so I’ve had some experience (while I do not sell it now). The Media Controller from control 4 has an 80 gb hard drive with the ability to control a Sony 777es changer for DVD management. The Escient that has the same ability is more expensive, and considerably more limited. While the interface of Escient’s is a little polished it took them a long time to get there, and I struggled through some terrible times with Escient.

Now to my last note. I am building a new home, 4000sq feet with 12 audio zones, three surround systems, 8x8 distributed component video, 16x8 distributed composite video, 68 lighting loads, security, 7 zones of HVAC, sprinkler system, and probably more that I’m not thinking of right now. For all that I’m thinking of Control 4. While I know that an AMX or Crestron system would be a little easier to use, and more attractive, I will be fine with the Control 4. The difference in price is so great that being confined to the Control 4 “box” is a limitation that I am wiling to live with. Plus if I tried to do one of the other two there is no way that I could afford to do the system, so…

My $.79.

Nice post ttocs . Welcome to the forum .

Thanks, AJF

I know that Control 4 is not perfect, but all the negative comments from people that have never used it really makes me wonder why.

I've worked with a lot of products in the last 16 years and most, if not all, have had hicups at the start.

Learning how to work within the contraints of any product is what makes someone successful in this industry.

ttocs

Im just wondering how you get 7 zones of HVAC in a 4000 sq ft house:) Is that normal?

No, but I saw six at a house that size on Wednesday. The customer has lived in the house for 25 years and is doing a gut-rehab, and is tired of being cold in the winter.

thanks for saying what I didn't have the patience to. How long did it take Crestron to get their video distribution working as well as it does now? Similairly C4's lighitng products next to Homeworks. C4 is about best value for the dollar, they don't claim to be the best in the industry.

Well it's not normal, but I have ins for discounts on equipment, so...

Master Bed (I like it cold), master bath (like it a warmer), common area on the first floor, guest suite on the first floor, guest suite in the basement, common area in the basement, theater.

Also why would you have 8 HD displays for two people, because of the discounts. I talk about doing the system in Control 4 due to the price, but remember that's at cost. I wouldn't be doing this large of a system without the discount, at least not right when I moved in. Gotta love the toys that we get cheap.


ttocs

Thanks jcmca,

In the last month I have had to replace a new PAD8A and had a second one that is acting flaky. I've had a higher rate of failure in Crestron lighting then I have in Control 4 so far (I know I have been lucky as they did have a bad batch hit the shelves)

I'm also a Homeworks dealer. As far as lighting is concerned I am having a hard time finding faults with control 4. I am able to set up complicated programming that makes the system very usable. I do think that the 6 button keypad from Control 4 is unattractive and a little clumsy. Other then that the dimmers and switches feel really good, the ability to change the LEDs in programming is very nice, and again programming is very easy. As a stand alone lighting system they are very nice. Plus you get the additions in automation.

ttocs

what is your take on the recent NY times articale that ststed theat the product is going to be sold at Home depot? don't you feel you are doing all the testing for a product that is going to be sold at any DIY or electrical supply house. I never used the product and from what i ave seen it looks great but i have a problem with the direction not the product.

Whats funny is that if you bag the system on any forum you get the same few responses that all say that they never have problems.

I wonder how many companies have reps respond to boards to perform damage control.