I offered you $5 for the HK amp, offer still stands

First off! Dont ever negotiate from MSRP! Always Negotiate off of invoice!
2nd off! Know exactly what model/make/options you want

You will want to go to the popular forums for the Brand of car (Nissan-BMW-GM Etc) and go to the appropriate sub forum for the model (370z-M3/4-Silverado-etc) and usually you can find posted sheets of invoice, interest rates, moneyfactors etc for everything including the options. These are ironically usually posted by sponsor dealers as advertising!

Also please know that "invoice" number is NOT the true number either as that invoice number does not include holdbacks,dealer only incentives, bank kickback for financing etc. Its not unheard of to get 1-2% below invoice...Another thing that helps is to go to huge chain dealerships, or automalls that are owned by companies like "penske AG" http://www.penskeautomotive.com/ This is because they only make money on the hold backs, and kickbacks for volume so it is very very easy to negotiate off of invoice because they need to "MOVE" as many vehicles as possible.

Don't be afraid to travel a few hours for a good deal, another thing I can recommend is to send your offer out to all the dealers around, Don't use the main emails from the website, use the little chat features to "talk" to a salesmen and get their direct email address, then send your offer for a car.

If your financing your car, get 3rd party financing lined up (pre-approval) your bank/credit unions are a good place to go for this. You can then negotiate everything (make sure they know you have pre-approval) the dealership will still want to run your credit, but this is good for you as usually they can and WILL beat the bank where you got your pre-aproval from! Just know that you will want to do all of your financing and shopping within 30 days, this allows banks to to make hard inquires against your credit without damaging your credit with multiple pulls. FICO allows unlimited auto/mortgage loan inquiries within 30days of the first "PULL"

If you are leasing a car you will HAVE to use the auto manufactures bank, but as long as you know the moneyfactors for top teir credit (Above 700) you can make sure they arent marking it up! Just know that interest rates/moneyfactors change among credit scores. the lower the number the higher your going to pay..generally if your score is below 640 you wont get leasing and you will get nailed on interest.

If you are trading in your car, make sure the dealer doesnt know about it until you negotiate the final deal on the car your buying then hit him with a trade in, but make sure you average KBB-Galves-NADA numbers together, this usually gets you within a few hundred dollars of their secret book number..NEVER rely on one number from online..Also take the car to carmax if you have one near you to get their number!

Also, Dont be afraid of ordering a car...usually the cars on lots are stripers or fully loaded and rarely have what you actually want. What many people dont understand is most dealerships actually like you ordering a car because its "free money" to them. the car goes into the system as "sold" they get their numbers and helps their quota. They just have to place the order and have it arrive on their lot with very little time invested in the deal.

Dont EVER buy a car between january-may this is because all the quotas and holdbacks etc get reset January 1st. Also the best time to start negotiating is around the 20th of the month as the managers are looking at sales numbers and need to start hitting them. If you aren't picky and can deal with whats on the lot you can get a smoking deal on December 31st

for my jeep i went to a dealer in DC and got 5% under invoice, was literally the smoothest transaction I have ever done, Did everything by email and only ever met my salesmen on the day of delivery. I generally do this with all my car purchases! My rule of thumb is ill negotiate 2% under invoice with a maximum cap of $500 OVER invoice.

One last thing, make sure you know your laws. NJ Doc fee is capped out at 350 however NY is capped out at 75...This is also a negotiable fee, although I dont beat the dealer up to much over this.

Finaly- dont ever be afraid to walk away from a deal. By doing everything over email it pulls out the emotional aspect of the caar buying experience, over email it allows you to stay in control of every aspect. use the forums to your advantage, alot of times sponsor dealers will automatically give you their best deal!

"Invoice" is a scam to trick people that think they know about the car industry. Sorry, that's just the truth. They basically make up "invoice"

Yup! Kbb/true car are scams for this... It's made up.

To be clear on my above post I negotiate from the true invoice...this is why digging through forums helps. When you nail the dealer with the true number of what he's going to pay and not the made up invoice number he knows you know your shit!

I'm surprised anyone would feel good about walking out the door at or 1000 below invoice! You should do much better than that, with the exception of some popular/hot new models.

Research, research, research. If you don't want to do that, then do costco or other online service, which is usually very hard to beat.

If you like to play the negotiation game, find two dealers with the same spec car, and work them against each other. Be honest and upfront by telling them both what's up, and that you will be from the one that has the best up-front out-the-door price. Show them the other offer so they believe you. Go back and forth a couple times. Be willing to walk out, and do so once or twice to be sure you got it as low as you can!

This is ridiculous.

The atmosphere of our planet is 80% or so nitrogen. You can get 80% nitrofill with a freakin' bicycle pump. If you intend to get a higher percentage of the gas in the tires to be nitrogen, you have to get the air out from inside the tire.

It's not possible to totally empty a tire, and I haven't seen any "nitrogen rooms" where they take the wheel and the tire, then assemble them in there while the worker dons a mask to get oxygen while his respired carbon dioxide is pumped out of the room.

It's hokum.

if it was pure "Hokum" the race teams wouldnt use it. F1 is a billion dollar industry and they fill their tyres with Nitrogen to provide a more stable platform regardless of tyre temperature.

These tyres are fitted at the race track and AFAIK also without being in a 100% sterile nitrogen environment.

I did some of these things people state here. Lots of great info.

Do lots of online price research. Know the price you want to pay before going into the dealership. I avoided the dealership, and just emailed, stating all options and the price o wanted to pay. I had a list of 10 dealerships within 250 miles, but the first took my offer.

When they started to add fees, my offer dropped in price, accordingly.

Sell your car elsewhere. Keep it out of the deal.

Hehe, nitrofil.

Even that though is still not a true number because what they are really paying varies based on things like total volume for the month and if they get you into financing or not.

Air compressors generate moisture. It's well proven that nitrofill doesn't change as much as plain air with temp changes.

I see dealer invoice simply as a MAP type of price. Start there and work your way down, that's the highest you should pay.

I don't think the true cost is out on the web because only the owners and a few of their staff know how much the manuf. pays back in rebates after the cars have sold. I'm willing to bet there is at least a 30-40% gross profit margin at sticker.

Dealers and the manuf. have just created this brilliant network of web prices and invoice prices to give people the perception they simply can't buy it for less than the web's stated invoice price.

Thanks for the info.

Idk. I get gm employee pricing
I walk into gm dealer tell them I get factory employee discount. Then it is what it is.

Nissan Mercedes Chrysler and Mitsubishi will honor the discount as well.

You can go through all the internet forums for particular vehicles and get an idea of what others are paying. That is how I came up with what I thought was a fair price for the Jeep I ordered. Could I have been douchey and got another $500 off? Maybe. Not worth the experience IMHO. I just do not like playing the games with those guys. They hate it as much as I do I am sure. This is another reason to do all your communication via email. The internet sales guys are generally easier to deal with. It is a whole different dynamic when you seek them out waving $$ at them vs. you wandering onto the lot and being chased around by the golf cart mafia.

I rarely seek out sales people in any store. I try to avoid the furniture sales people, the appliance sales people, the clothing sales people. I actually only go shopping if I already know exactly what I want, or I am just killing time and am not planning on buying anything. I am sure there are people out there who need to go be told by someone what to by and why. I am not one of them.

Same here. I don't need to be sold a car. I already want it or i wouldnt be there. You cant high pressure sell me into something i dont want. I just need someone to do paper work and negotiate.