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| Topic: | HD Modulator Suggestions This thread has 31 replies. Displaying posts 16 through 30. |
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| Post 16 made on June 5, 2013 at 12:03 |
Late Night Bill Long Time Member |
Joined: Posts: | February 2004 495 |
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It was on the internet so it must be true! ;) Yes component can exist in digital form inside of a product (so can composite & s-video), but not as an input to a device. |
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| Post 17 made on June 5, 2013 at 12:18 |
Ernie Gilman Yes, That Ernie! |
Joined: Posts: | December 2001 30,104 |
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That same wiki article mentions that digital component video is Y, Cb, Cr. Back when this was defined for component signals, there actually were some inputs that would accept Y, Cb, Cr and the analog Y, Pb, Pr, but I have only seen Y, Pb, Pr outputs; and of course component outputs aren't labeled this way any more anyway. I wonder when the wiki article said that digital component is becoming more popular was written. Apparently wiki writers don't realize that dates are needed for the information to stay worthwhile, especially when they say "are becoming" ! ! |
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw |
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| OP | Post 18 made on June 5, 2013 at 12:54 |
MediaImageAV Long Time Member |
Joined: Posts: RC XP: | June 2012 373 60⭐︎ |
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On June 5, 2013 at 11:55, Late Night Bill said...
One consideration you have to make on the ZeeVee is how you will use it in your application. From their web page, you can see that their 'Pro' models are labeled as "Unencrypted HDMI input" which means they do not support HDCP. This may be fine for some applications such as digital signage, airport terminal displays, or other non-consumer applications, but will likely be an issue for consumer applications such as DirecTV, Cable, or other set top boxes. Distributing analog component through a matrix switch is probably going to be your most cost effective solution. Are you running sound to the TVs as well? When I initially spoke to ZeeVee about the unencrypted HDMI they told me DirecTv would "probably" work but that I should find out from DirecTv. Good luck. I don't know a thing about encrypted vs unencrypted. Other than actually trying, how would I find out if this would work? Yes, need to run sound to most of the TVs. ZeeVee said the 2 HDMI unit will retail for $2275. $4550 for 4 HDMI sources to 13 TVs sounds pretty hard to beat. Add Cat extenders to an HDMI matrix and I don't think any can come close. This assumes the unit works and the encrypted HDMI is not an issue. Small details :) |
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| Post 19 made on June 5, 2013 at 13:04 |
Brentm Ethereal Home Theater |
Joined: Posts: | July 2003 2,693 |
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On June 5, 2013 at 13:54, MediaImageAV said...
| When I initially spoke to ZeeVee about the unencrypted HDMI they told me DirecTv would "probably" work but that I should find out from DirecTv. Good luck. I don't know a thing about encrypted vs unencrypted. Other than actually trying, how would I find out if this would work? Yes, need to run sound to most of the TVs. ZeeVee said the 2 HDMI unit will retail for $2275. $4550 for 4 HDMI sources to 13 TVs sounds pretty hard to beat. Add Cat extenders to an HDMI matrix and I don't think any can come close. This assumes the unit works and the encrypted HDMI is not an issue. Small details :) DirecTV; Most channels will work (today). HBO and PPV however will not (they ar HDCP enabled). |
Brent McCall
Paid Endorser for;
Ethereal (386) 846-7264 Cell |
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| Post 20 made on June 5, 2013 at 14:57 |
Ernie Gilman Yes, That Ernie! |
Joined: Posts: | December 2001 30,104 |
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The Gefen HDMI Detective Plus allows you to capture the EDID information of a display, record it in the Detective, then send this info back to the source from the Detective all the time. The output of the Detective has no EDID signal and it sounds like that would work with the ZeeVeez.
The first time we used this in a somewhat complicated system, it reduced input switching time from about seven seconds to zero. This might be the rest of your answer.
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A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw |
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| Post 21 made on June 5, 2013 at 15:40 |
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Joined: Posts: | April 2012 1,168 |
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On June 5, 2013 at 13:18, Ernie Gilman said...
That same wiki article mentions that digital component video is Y, Cb, Cr. Back when this was defined for component signals, there actually were some inputs that would accept Y, Cb, Cr and the analog Y, Pb, Pr, but I have only seen Y, Pb, Pr outputs; and of course component outputs aren't labeled this way any more anyway. I wonder when the wiki article said that digital component is becoming more popular was written. Apparently wiki writers don't realize that dates are needed for the information to stay worthwhile, especially when they say "are becoming" ! ! It was my understanding that YCbCr refers to component video in a consumer application, YPbPr is the same signal format in a professional application, hence "C" and "P". I've never seen a copper wire with a digital signal. Ultimately there is a voltage rise and fall time and it is an analog signal. |
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| Post 22 made on June 5, 2013 at 16:45 |
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Joined: Posts: | June 2007 1,325 |
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On June 5, 2013 at 13:18, Ernie Gilman said...
I wonder when the wiki article said that digital component is becoming more popular was written. Apparently wiki writers don't realize that dates are needed for the information to stay worthwhile, especially when they say "are becoming" ! ! HDMI, Anyone?? |
MikeZTC, CTS-D, CTS-I, DMC-E |
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| Post 23 made on June 5, 2013 at 16:46 |
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Joined: Posts: | June 2007 1,325 |
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On June 5, 2013 at 16:40, Lowhz said...
It was my understanding that YCbCr refers to component video in a consumer application, YPbPr is the same signal format in a professional application, hence "C" and "P". I've never seen a copper wire with a digital signal. Ultimately there is a voltage rise and fall time and it is an analog signal. No. YCbCr is digital, YPbPr is analog. HD-SDI is a good example of a copper (coax) cable with a digital signal. Also see DS3 telecom circuits. You're correct in that there is a rise and fall time, but the underlying coding is zeroes and ones rather than an analog variable voltage as is the case with YPbPr three-wire component video. |
MikeZTC, CTS-D, CTS-I, DMC-E |
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| Post 24 made on June 5, 2013 at 16:50 |
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Joined: Posts: | June 2007 1,325 |
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The question you need to ask ZeeVee is whether or not the HDMI input 'supports' HDCP or if it reports back as a 'non-compliant sink'. You can test this if you have a ZeeVee and a Quantum Data 780 in your hands at the same time. I've used the Adtec YUV2QAM extensively in head-end build-outs. It's a broadcast grade encoder and supports many more features that the Zeevee and Contemporary Research encoders do not. |
MikeZTC, CTS-D, CTS-I, DMC-E |
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| Post 25 made on June 6, 2013 at 14:24 |
Ernie Gilman Yes, That Ernie! |
Joined: Posts: | December 2001 30,104 |
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On June 5, 2013 at 16:40, Lowhz said...
I've never seen a copper wire with a digital signal. Ultimately there is a voltage rise and fall time and it is an analog signal. You really said that? (Just hold on for a moment, though.) In our normal experience, we have digital signals on the copper of coaxial digital audio; LAN cables; and though PC board traces might not qualify as wires, all PC board traces carrying digital signals in all computers have digital signals. You're right that there is a voltage rise and fall. This is a major way we put digital signals onto a wire. There are also methods of encoding the digital signal in some way. Our DSL signals are digital signals on wire, but they are not simply rises and falls. You are totally correct that any signal, once on a wire, will not long remain a perfect rise and fall but is subject to such things as capacitance, induced interference, transmission line effects. If you are a digital engineer and have a perfect digital signal that you want to get to some place fifty feet away, you'd better understand how the real world, which is analog, will smoosh that perfect digital signal. Otherwise your nice squarish-wave-looking signals will become very rounded off indeed and will not be able to be understood by the circuitry that could understand them when three inches from the source. As I see it, we put digital signals on wire. Those signals are then affected by effects that we became used to understanding when things were all analog, so we call them analog effects. Now that I think about it, they aren't analog effects at all: they are just the effects of the real world. You can't say even they are the effects of physics, either, as physics is a structured way of understanding the real world, not the cause of the real world. |
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw |
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| Post 26 made on June 6, 2013 at 23:22 |
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Joined: Posts: | April 2012 1,168 |
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It's digital signaling, it's an analog medium. Therefore it ultimately is an analog signal.
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| Post 27 made on June 7, 2013 at 05:32 |
Brentm Ethereal Home Theater |
Joined: Posts: | July 2003 2,693 |
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On June 7, 2013 at 00:22, Lowhz said...
It's digital signaling, it's an analog medium. Therefore it ultimately is an analog signal. What he said. It is read as "Digital" but carried as "Analog", which is why HDMI over copper has so many issues. Note that Fiber also has problems (just different ones). |
Brent McCall
Paid Endorser for;
Ethereal (386) 846-7264 Cell |
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| Post 28 made on June 7, 2013 at 09:13 |
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Joined: Posts: RC XP: | October 2001 783 85⭐︎ |
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On June 7, 2013 at 06:32, Brentm said...
What he said.
It is read as "Digital" but carried as "Analog", which is why HDMI over copper has so many issues.
Note that Fiber also has problems (just different ones). Very interesting, I haven't ever noticed that/realized that. That does help explain a lot, like with long HDMI cables. |
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| Post 29 made on June 8, 2013 at 06:50 |
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Joined: Posts: RC XP: | August 2001 1,275 142⭐︎ |
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Didnt realise how damn expensive these things are, would love to get one for home that did DVB- T or C. The old analogue ones dont work to well with modem gear, mind you they did only cost $50.
If a vendor was able to have them so you could plug a module in for what input type was require would be great, you could have combination of HDMI or component or VGA etc.
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| Post 30 made on August 1, 2013 at 05:21 |
omnitech2000 Lurking Member |
Joined: Posts: | August 2013 2 |
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On June 4, 2013 at 19:05, vwpower44 said...
Don't get me wrong, the zeevee has its place. Can you give some details? Have you seen the new ZVpro810 and ZVpro820? Does anyone have any experience with the CE Labs QM101 or QM102? |
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