I should add that per my earlier post, they no longer approve new proposals for ART per older spec. So JAP needs to continue using the older solution or apply for new license if they want to change the architecture....

Speaking of Infocomm

What type of tv and size do you think would be required to prove to people what kind of image quality is has? I know many think a 42 is too small. 50" 60" plasma lcd?

Size doesn't matter if I can stand 1 inch from the set and it runs at 1080p and runs in 1:1 pixel mapping ("just scan" or whatever the TV company calls it).

If we are not allowed to get close to it, then yes, bigger the better.

And for type, I prefer LCD. Plasma dither makes it hard to closely examine things at pixel levels sometimes.

Again, key is 1:1 mapping or the display will be resizing adding it's own artifacts which would be impossible to separate from that of JAP.

Amir, you are the first CI to put the puzzle pieces together, and I applaud your independent research. For the record, the Just Add Power solutions are HDCP 1.2 compliant. As long as nobody comes out with an HDCP source that refuses to allow their content to be shown on 1.x compliant devices, the owner of a Just Add Power system will be able to enjoy the benefits of our HD over IP(tm) solution. Now before anybody goes apoplectic over HDCP 1.2 vs. 2.0 sources, I would ask you to think about this a little further. For starters, the HDCP 2.0 standard has a clause about backwards support for 1.x, including 2.x to 1.x interfaces. A different way to thing about this is to ask yourself the question "will a content provider ever decide to release a player that won't work on the bazillion HDCP 1.x compliant screens already sold to a gazillion consumers, and if they do, will the consumers be so enamored with it that they'll throw out all their old screens?"

I look forward to meeting you next week at Booth N2873. For those of you on the other side of the pond, I'll also be at booth A2 in London the following week for CEDIA-UK.

P.S. I wonder if I can get 39centstamp to put together a graphic about the importance of being an ART Appreciator ?????

OK, I am waiting for flight home from Infocomm and thought I add a word or two here.

Ed and crew were nice enough to spend some time with me playing with the system and talking to them. Ed had also bought the DVE BD disc which I was thankful for. Turned out though, we didn't need a test disc. The compression system visibly distorts high frequency content (picture edges). I thought at first this was scaling error as that can also introduces such jaggies but Ed assured me all the sets including the source were set to the same mode (other displays did not show the same problem).

So for a person who really understands video, this is not a lossless encoding. Perceptual lossless schemes do not exhibit such easy to find artifacts. Usual artifacts are slight softening of the video or a bit of blocking artifacts but not every edge getting distorted.

To me then, the solution is not a general purpose means to distribute HDMI throughout the home. You would not want to use this for any critical viewing in primary locations in the home (large flat panel, projector, etc). Lack of 5.1 audio emphasizes the same restriction.

Rather, the solutions is a low cost way to get protected video to another location in the home or place of business. Good examples Ed used were a TV in a bedroom or in a sports bar. In that sense, I think the first gen product at half the price is even a better fit than the second gen. Yes, it also introduced its own artifacts but again, if it is not for critical viewing, it doesn't matter. I was actually less bothered by the artifacts of version 1 than version 2! At least in the demo material I watched.

Finishing the post with a line Ed used: "if you don't like the picture, don't buy it!" :)

Part of the demonstration of the 2G prototypes (can't emphasize PROTOTYPE enough) included a side-by-side comparison of 1G, 2G, and direct to Blu-Ray. We accomlished this by using one of the new Panasonic 3D players with dual HDMI outputs. An HDMI splitter was attached to one of the outputs and used to feed the 1G and the 2G transmitters, while the Blu-Ray was directly attached to the other HDMI output.

Shortly after Amir visited our booth somebody noticed that the monitor connected to the 2G was in interlaced mode when watching the Blu-Ray player, instead of progressive mode. With all of the traffic of the show, we were not able to determine what exactly caused the interlaced downgrade (Player, Splitter, 1G EDID, 2G Prototype, monitor, or cables). However, we did find a way to force the monitor back into progressive mode when watching the Blu-Ray. At that point, the "jaggies" Amir reports observing on the prototypes went away. The "jaggies" did not happen with the Vudu or the PC HDMI outputs, and were perfect reproductions. Other visitors from RC and IP came by later, and saw the video demonstration without such problems (hopefully they'll chime in).

We will investigate this further, and determine what it takes to prevent this from happening before the 2G's are put into mass production. I'll let you know what we find out.

Ed, are you talking about the input being interlaced, or the display being on interlace?

That's the problem, we couldn't figure out at the show if it was the input or the display causing the glitch, and while we were able to overcome it a couple hours after Amir's visit, we are not sure exactly what "fixed" it (too many things were changed at the same time). For all I know it was being caused by the HDMI splitter (yeah, it was a cheap one) or perhaps this was a "feature" in the new fangled dual output player, we just didn't have the luxury of being able to spend all of our time at the show playing with the pieces to recreate the problem - too many visitors wanting to see the 2G solution. The 4 new Panasonic displays we were using at the show won't be delivered to JAP in Florida for a couple weeks (I marked the one that was going in/out of interlaced mode), and I'm at CEDIA in London next week demonstrating the 2G Prototypes there. When I get back to Florida we will have the time/resources together to systematcially determine why it happened. If intermittent interlacing is a bug in the 2G design, we can fix it.

I may be completely off, but my guess of the dual HDMI outputs of the Bluray is supposed to be used one for video and one for audio. I would think that once one output synced with the display and confirmed the 1080p resolution that the second becomes the default for audio only, which I sort of understand is handled a little differently.

This would make sense to me b/c it would prevent the content from being shared on two displays in 1080p, similar to forcing the components down to 480p when HDMI is active.

This is 100% just a guess.

Ed, as you recall, I kept insisting this appeared to be a display problem but you wouldn't let me help you diagnose it. If the booth was busy at that time, I could understand. But it was just me and you all. I came wanting to be impressed but left disappointed and unwelcome. So much for Alan thinking I was in your pocket :).

Your explanation sounds right to me as interlaced mode would cause the same issue, but not being able to see the corrected output I can't spec the product for our business. The artifacts were so bad I did not attempt to look at the rest of the picture to see any other issue.

My feelings aside, it is great to hear that there was a resolution to the problem. I guess I will have to wait for CEDIA to kick the tires again.

I look forward to seeing you at CEDIA in Atlanta.

Well first of all, ALL LCD and Plasmas are progressive only. Therefore they could not be set on interlaced.

To be fair, an LCD could accept an interlaced scan rate and render all of the nasty artifacts in discussion.

Secondly, the set can't just 'be in interlaced mode', it displays what it is sent, which is determined by EDID. I love my VP403, it comes in handy for situations like this.

I'll play nice and keep the rest of my comments to myself

It's good to be loved; it's better to be remembered:)

Alan