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Welcome to the X10 forum!
This thread has 7 replies. Displaying all posts.
Post 1 made on Monday March 29, 1999 at 20:04
Daniel Tonks
Historic Forum Post
Welcome! Let me know if something doesn't work.
OP | Post 2 made on Tuesday March 30, 1999 at 22:10
Steve Horn
Historic Forum Post
Great Idea! And two interesting forums found in one day. Cool. I've been using X10 for y e a r s so this will be an interesting site for me.
Thanks,
Steve
OP | Post 3 made on Thursday June 17, 1999 at 02:03
Greg brown
Historic Forum Post
Hello Techheads,
In your overwelled veiws on the X-10 system as neat as it seems to be, It definitely has its share of problems as most of you know. It is a product for small applications only. No knock to the system it has lasted because of the price verse control. But, it is very limited unless used with the computor controled unit and even then should not be considered a full on lighting control system. This recognition is reserved for the big boys ie. Lutron Interactive where it has (If, Then Logic). Price no object of course but, this is what lighting control is about. Even its little brother (Radio RA) has more control than X-10 and it works on large homes 5000' and even greater with better looking keypads that can be engraved what you like on each button. Still I have to say that I see why X-10 will be around for a while for the small applications it works most of the time. Anyway its the only one that I can afford.

Greg Brown
Entertainment Technologies
OP | Post 4 made on Thursday June 17, 1999 at 10:47
Robert
Historic Forum Post
Greg:

I thought I might share my experience with X-10 based home automation systems since it is the largest part of my business.

With the use of multiple amplified phase couplers, X-10 based home automation systems work very well in homes well over 5000 sq. ft. Specially designed phase coulplers can be linked together to work together in large homes without conficting with each other.

Also, I primarly use JDS Technologies, X-10 based home automation controllers. The Active Home product marketed by X10 isn't anything close to the JDS controllers. Many people get frustrated with the limitations of Active Home, but as you pointed out it, it costs less than $40.

JDS controllers range from a little over $300 to a little over $1000. The flagship product, Stargate, integrates X-10 control, telephony functions (voice mail with up to 8 mail boxes, Caller ID, paging, call forwarding, etc.), 16 digital inputs (motion sensors, rain meters, etc.), 8 analog inputs (temperature sensors, humidity sensors), 9 relay outputs (irrigation control, etc) 2 RS232 (serial) port outputs to both read and send ASCII to communicate with other products such as alarm systems and text paging services, and an RS485 port that allows connection of 16 other RS485 devices (thermostats, LCD control panels, etc.). The number of inputs/outputs can be expanded with optional I/O expander boards.

There is also an optional bidirectional IR controller that will learn up to 500 IR commands from exisiting IR remotes. This product is integrated with the Stargate controller. For example, you could press "123" on any IR remote and Stargate could respond by announcing "Home Theater Mode", dimming the lights, turning on your IR components, etc. It has 4 zoned IR outputs on board. You could also pick up any telephone in your home and press "CNN" to turn on your TV and watch CNN.

The Stargate runs completely independent of the PC. It has digital memory for the storage of up to 40 minutes of speech, and the firmware has hundreds of prerecorded words and phrases that can be constructed into speech for verbal confirmation. The verbal confirmations can be routed through the line-out (for an amplified speaker system), speaker out (for direct connection to several speakers), CO line (e.g., a hold message while a call is on hold), or the Intercom (e.g., to speak with someone at your front door).

The Stargate allows 6000-8000 lines of code with complex (nested) IF/THEN statements, macros, timers, flags, etc.

On our web site, we have some downloads (click on the downloads button) provide more information. We have a document that contains actual Stargate applications, and we also have some PDF files with the product's specifications.

Robert
RCI Automation
[Link: ourworld.compuserve.com]
OP | Post 5 made on Monday June 28, 1999 at 02:39
Greg Brown
Historic Forum Post
Robert:

Hey, thanks for the X-10
OP | Post 6 made on Monday June 28, 1999 at 03:19
Greg Brown
Historic Forum Post
Robert:

Hey, thanks for the X-10 information. All though I am aware of some of the products that you talk about in your response, I cant help wonder why anyone would want to spend the time or money into such a product that needs all of the special devices in order to make it work. Especialy on large projects. And even then not be as reliable as a dedicated lighting control system. I do appreciate the X-10 equipment. As I said, I have it in my home. But our goal for our customers is to give them the most reliable system. Unfortunately for us X-10 is not the answer, as easy as it would be to sell them a system that does not require any or a small amount of wiring. Thats not what we are about. Our first concern is no matter how neat a product is, it has to be very reliable. Then everything else is iceing. Even with your phase couplers, they do not fix the ultimate problem with X-10. RF noise problems surges and electrical spikes are the most common problems for the X-10 system. Since this is the way the signal travles. It really comes down to how much time you want to invest in a product that has these and other problems to deal with. My intrest to your responce to mine is not to put the X-10 system down at all. I would like to give you a system that we are currantly doing, so that we can compare prices with your system to ours. This should give both of us a learning opportunity into the two types of systems. Im real intrested to see the outcome of yours, since your expertice seems to be so great in the X-10 area.

Thanks
Greg Brown
Entertainment Technologies
Dallas Tx.

OP | Post 7 made on Saturday July 3, 1999 at 02:52
Robert
Historic Forum Post
Greg,

I appreciate your comments and agree with you about a dedicated hard wired system being more reliable, than an X-10 based system. With proper planning, an X-10 system can be very reliable however.

If a customer only needs to control a limited amount of lighting, a dedicated hard wired system might be the way to go if he can pull wires to the locations. If the customer doesn't want to run additional wiring, and also wants to control other subsystems, like HVAC and irrigation, there really isn't another pratical choice other than an X-10 based system. Also, the cost of an X-10 system is far less than the hard wired or the RF controlled competition when you are looking at a large scale application (normally about 1/10th of the cost of a hard wired system with the same capability, but slightly less reliability).

Robert
RCI Automation
OP | Post 8 made on Friday August 20, 1999 at 15:48
Jonathan Young
Historic Forum Post
You get what you pay for!


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