So, I finally did it. I got my T2 RF to work everywhere in house. It was a long and educational process. And there were several problems I had to discover and solve. So I'll tell the tale here now... discovery and solution. Anyone who is new to RF and having problems with it, may want to read this... I certainly gleaned alot from the posts of all the helpfull people here.

It all started a 1 1/2 years ago with (as it turns out fleeting) stock market riches. I was going to treat myself to the stereo of my dreams. That alone was a big enough problem... but after finally deciding on a whole house multi-zone system I had several installers come in and tell me how expensive the installation process was. Something that I was certain I could do myself (please no flaming - I admit it was a mistake).

The cost of most installation was in the 10-25k range (which at the time I considered ridiculous - now I consider a bargain). I looked at X10, Crestron and the like, Intellicontrol, and panel-based solutions. Anyway, being someone who did his own home automation and home networking I figured this would be a breeze. I figured I needed an RF based remote that would work throughout the house (as I have a VERY RELIABLE wireless 802.11b computer network), I figured this would be a simple installation.

So, I came across the T2 (the perfect solution) and was one of the original purchasers. I bought 3 remotes and the RF module... as well as a couple of power/video syncing devices. Bought the stereo, did my research by reading up on RF, reading other's installation woes/successes and embarked on programming the remote.

The programming was easy - period. No problems, no issues... though I came up with a rather large list of simple modifications that could be made to remote's programming language that could make the remote's configuration easier. For the record, aside from a B&O unit, I had no problems with the learning of codes.

The next step I figured would take a day. It has taken 20 days at least; 1 or 2 a month - until I finally - today - got it finished.

Running the wires and placing the unit was no problem... the RF just didn't work - period. Maybe 1 of 20 or 30 presses would be received. I played with the antennae placement, orientation - everything... the best placement was maybe a 2 or 3 hits out of 30. End of day one. Don't worry I won't go day by day.

I called Mitch and was one of the first to ask about placing 2 antennaes... there were warnings and cautions... and he wasn't sure. There were issues of RF in my area (I live very near an airport - which was a constant distration). So now I have 2 antennaes... and things improved and the first real problem surfaced. With the 2 antennaes, I started getting about 50% hits (problem not solved but it was getting better). And recall, this was in 1 room, not the whole house.

The problem, was the IRF-6 would receive the RF from the remote and the led's would just stay lit - never turn off. It was a while into a conversation with Mitch, that I discovered this was not correct behavior. After several days of testing... I finally figured (thanks to recommendations from board members), it was the result of a certain type of S-Video cable running from my Proceed AVP. Whenever I connected the cable the the IRF-6 got this RF "feedback loop" (for lack of a better term). When it was removed the unit worked correctly. As a note, I purchased a new cable of the same type (since my original thought was it was a bad cable - and the new 1 had the same affect)... It turns out (for me) the middle and low grade monster cable S-video cable running from any connector on my Proceed AVP will creates this problem. Oddly a POS "junker" S-video cable from a Sony Tivo did not have this problem - makes you think, eh?

Anyway, now I'm getting about 1/2 hits... and the unit is working properly. I had CB friend of mine come and look at the problem, and we created several "custom" antennaes based on the wavelength of the T2's 418MHz transmission band. I could at this point get around 80% hits from the main room... but found that if I split the antennae more the 2 times, the IRF-6 stopped registering a signal - period. So though I could get reception in most rooms by placing an antennae in each room, I couldn't get them all to work together. We began looking at combinations of amplifiers and antenuators to try and get the signal through all the combiners, et. al. Though we did finally get it to work, we could never get a hit rate above 50%.

Frustration created a delay at this point as I began giving up and looking at Crestron a bit more seriously. This was still before the big market collapse, so I started planning for a complete install... until this January that is... then it was back to the T2.... or perhaps running IR repeaters - which was sounding like a wise choice.

I really wanted RF and again, went to the boards and talked to Bill (homeautomationnet - Bill). He noted (and someone on the board indicated) that the new could TERK FM PRO antennae was the answer. His was really helpful, and cautious, but since he didn't have the "high gain T2" antennaes in stock yet, I tried the FM Pro. I went online to check the specs and found the FM Pro didn't "technically" receive the 418MHz band the T2 works on... but the Terk TV50 did. I called TERK (as someone on the board noted the FM Pro worked anyway) and talked to their tech support. They claimed it wouldn't and said go with the TV50. So, off to the stereo store to buy the suprising large and expensive (around $125 each) antennaes. I bought them both with the intentions of returning the one that didn't work - always an optimist.

At any rate... neither worked any better - at first try. Placement didn't give any better results... and with a little testing and the like... the FM Pro seemed to work a little better than the TV50 did... but neither were much better than the normal antennae.

It was then that I decided I really have to deal with exact placement - what a waste of time that was... but it did help me find the problem. I turned my stero off, placed the antennaes in differing locations and everything was working! I mean everything hit - 100% finally. Success wasn't quite that easy, because after I finished the installation and tried it... it didn't work again... back to 80%. Finally, I figured out... it was stereo itself. When on, the stereo was emitting a fair amount of RF (it just happened that I usually played the stereo during previous tries) and hadn't this time. Placement away from the stereo (BTW- the intial antennae placement was around 12 feet from the stereo) became a priority. 90% hit rate... finally getting to useable. I placed the antennaes on the far side of the room - around 20-25 feet from the stereo. As a note, the T2 "basic" antennae did not work from this distance even at 80% (dropped to around 70%)... so I was now using solely the TERK antennaes.

Next thing to be learned.... I finally sat down and read the manuals for the TERK antennaes and found that the specific frequencies of the T2 were actually filtered (as is FM) for the TV50... so though their tech support recommended this... I started comparing the TV50 and the FM PRO again. Wow... what a difference. When the stereo was off, there wasn't much difference in reception... both were around 100% - fact. However, when the stereo was on, the TV50 was significantly worse at reception than the FM Pro. Since I had been using the TV50... I was delighted to find the FM Pro worked in all the "dark or black" spots the TV50 didn't receive from. In fact, the FM Pro made the unit VERY USEABLE... hit rates of 95% or so with the stero on. I figure some of the stereo equipment was probably emitting RF that the TF50 was picking up and the FM PRO wasn't. Any ideas... Either way it was finally working well... And BTW - EXACT antennae placement at this point didn't matter at all. I could place it horizontally, vertically, high or low... didn't matter... though laying on the floor was weak.

Placing another FM Pro (vertically) on a closet door in another part of my house got coverage virtually everywhere else in the house. So I had a 95% hit rate and good coverage.

The last fix... was something pretty obvious... but I just put off... that was to place the IRF-6 and the ENITER antennae cable and the splitters into a metal box. This got the final 5%. I figure the final length of antennae to the IRF-6 was picking up some of the stereo's RF... when I close the box door... I get great hit rates... when I open it... I get some misses.

Anyway... so here is how it turns out... I have 2 FM Pro antennae's ($125 each)... I quad shielded RG-6 cables from the FM Pros to the combiner which via adapters is connected to the IRF-6. Now... I actually have the 50ohm and 52ohm cabling from the radio-daze miss-adventure... but the 75ohm cabling is better shielded I think... or just seems to work better with the TERM FM Pro antennae... so since I had a crimper for it I used it... and I think it works better. BTW - I use both line amplifiers that come with the TERKs.

My last adventure, which I will begin someday in the future, is to put a splitter in just before IRF-6 and attach it to my Tuner for radio recption... but I haven't done this yet.

Also, as for the power and video syncing... I didn't end up using them. In the end, I created a menuing scheme that placed power buttons for the appropriate zone near each page... allowing easy access and more reliable manual control. I know the arguement... if you want to use macros... you should really connect in this matter. As it turns out... even with good reception (as I have now), using macros seemed to confuse more than it solved problems. I do have some, but generally not in the "power up/down" arena. Generally, I have macros only to select inputs once power is established. In a multizone system, power syncing doesn't work well, if you don't have reporting back to the remote (as Crestron and the like do).

Anyway... that is my adventure. It took way too long to discover all of this stuff... and required much more work than I originally planned. I don't know if this will help anyone or not. I figured I owed the story (both to purge myself) and from the clues I got from similar posters on the board.

I'll check back for a couple of days, if anyone wants to respond or ask a follow-up question... otherwise, this is now behind me - finally.

Good luck,
A proud T2 owner...

Proud,

That info could be helpful. I hope you feel better now.

Might I ask what kind of range you are getting with your latest antennae scheme?

Thanks.

Excellent post... and wow, those antennas really ARE that expensive!

Range is everywhere in the house.

I keep the stereo in a room in the basement. With the basement antennae, I get coverage EVERYWHERE (no dark spots - AT ALL) in the basement (except the room the stereo is in due to the RF problems... where i get around 50% hits... so I generally use IR there). My basement is probably 50x25 with lots of metal ducts on the walls and on the ceiling. Because of the ductwork (and such) I always figured on the 2nd antennae on the first floor. From the 2nd antennae on the 1st floor, I get pretty complete coverage on the entire floor (with a couple of dark spots when too much ducting is in the way - I know where it runs). Probably 90% coverage (including all major areas) of 4 main rooms on floor 1. On floor 2 I get nearly the same (if not a bit better) coverage through all 4 rooms.

As for "as the crow flies" range, I don't know. I haven't tried the remote outside yet... but I'm guessing it won't work well... my computer network won't work outside at all if I don't crack a window or leave a door open. I live in a cold area, so insulation (which is generally lined with foil) and low energy windows keep the RF in.

Let me know if I can help with anything else,
Cliff

Cliff,

Thanks for the post; I remember our conversations and your frustration. It's to bad that the IRF-6 causes such problems in some environments, but wow what a rewarding product when it is dialed in. I know a lot of people that have been looking at some of the other remotes out there but after messing with some of the latest toys I am sticking with my T2.

Bill
www.homeautomationnet.com

Bill,
Thanks for your help... you were very generous with your time and advice.
Cliff

Cliff,

That may very well be the longest post I have ever seen. Thanks for taking the time! I no longer have the T2, but I loved the RF function. Fortunately I only had a few tiny dead spots, but knowing me, I probably would have wanted to kill those too:-) Your post would have come in very handy.

Can I just get clarification on something....

If I want to extend the placement of my antenna what cable is best to use?

I assume 75 ohm is ideal, but it there 75 ohm cable that isn't a thick as the normal TV antenna cable coax? (Is there something nice and thin like what's attached to the IRF-6?)

Thanks
Richard

The antennae for the T2 is based on radio antennaes or 50 ohm cabling (which is the thin stuff you are referring to). You should probably only use this type for a simple extension. For longer runs you could use the shielded 52 ohm type (which is really thick). Both can be purchased someplace like radio shack.

The antennaes I used had amplifiers and used 75 ohm RG6 cabling, so I used this for the long runs. I would not use this as a standard replacment as it has too much resistance and it will likely cause signal loss.

Best, Cliff

I have had success simply extending the lead using RG6 and stripping off the sheild and jacket from the center conductor by 6 3/4" which is the same length as the original antenna. The RF module is what appears to be the most RF sensitive and I mount the unit as far from equipment as possible.