Hi All,

Another newbie to this area. I currently own a Onkyo HTS 650 Home Theater in a Box. I think it's pretty good for the price but I am itching to upgrade to something a little more substantial. I have a Sony KV-36FS17 WEGA TV (which isnt HDTV) but still has a great picture. I also have an HTM MX-500/IR-Clone remote which I love.

My DVD changer is good to go, for now, (Progressive Scan JVC XV-FA900BK) which plays DVD Audio CDs which are awsome.

I would like to get some better speakers and a better Receiver. I have owned Onkyo products for almost 20 years and have been quite pleased with the quality. My understanding is that the integra line is a step up from Onkyo but is made by Onkyo. Any thought's on the Onkyo/Integra line?

I really like the looks of the Harmon Kardon Receivers but it appears they don't put out as much wattage as the other receivers within their class. Plus I see lot's of postings on the HTM site complaining about problems getting the HTM remotes to work correctly with HK receivers.

I would like to stay within a $1000.00 - $1500.00 budget. I know that doesn't buy squat in the Home Theater arena. But Hey! I really can't even afford or justify that!

Sorry for the long winded request. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

You'll have to go middle of the line to lower end if you want to stay in that price range. $1500 will get you a good reciever and no speakers, or good speakers, and a piece of a reciever. You can get a decent Yamaha RXV-740 reciever for about $600 retail, or step up a notch and get the RXV-2300 for about $900. They sound great, have excellent discretes, and are pretty easy to set up.

Mitch,

The Integra line fantastic. All discrete codes, lots of setup features, adjustable crossovers, killer DAC's for great sound quality.

As for speakers, If you are on a budget you may want to buy them in stages. Start with the fronts, then add a sub, then surround and last the center. Buy the best speakers you can afford.

Check out Definitive Technology ProCinema line for overachieving budget speakers.

Thanks for your replies. Maybe I will do as you suggested DDeca and buy in stages starting with the receiver. What receivers, other than the integra line, in the $1000.00 to 1500.00 price range would you recommend?

Mitch, just look at these receivers, unless you're installing a sound system for an Auditorium, you don't need to spend that kind of money:
[Link: shopping.com]
Or look at:
www.yamaha.com
www.onkio.com
www.denon.com
Also look at some excellent speakers on www.shopping.com by typing home theater speakers on the search window, that fits your budget.
J. Bond

Mitch,

the Integra DTR-5.4 retails for $600 and you won't find many receivers at that price that are this loaded. It should do the job unless you are in a large room. For $1000, the DTR-6.4 adds a little more power and THX certification.

BTW, the benefit of spending a little more money on a receiver is not to fill up an auditorium, but for sound quality. Good speakers will sound much better when being powered by higher powered amplifiers, even at reasonable volume levels.

Here are some alternate ideas...As you already have a speaker/receiver kit, I am assuming that the room is not huge and you are looking for **better** sound (a whole entire debate in itself). If you want just "louder" sound, anything "high powered" will do the trick with sensitive speakers.

BUT...if you are looking to make a big gain in audio improvement (soundstage, imaging, clarity, range and increased volume levels) then read on...

Your price range is getting you into above average levels for a surround system. Any receiver in that range will do the job (Yamaha, Denon, Integra, Onkyo, HK). If you really are looking to do it piece meal and are on a budget (add speakers later or start with fronts, etc. as others have suggested), you may want to check out some of the specialty brands such as NAD, Rotel, Arcam, just to name a few.

Why bother? Because they generally sound superior to the mass market brands and they are in your budget!

$ range is easily in the $700-1,500 mark, so don't miss the opportunity to look into other items. Try to demo a NAD T 743 first($699 starting price www.nadelectronics.com ) to see if the difference is noticeable to your ears.

If you are serious about getting the best sound for your $, then spend some time listening to the products in your area. Unless you live in an area that has no dealers, it would be a shame not to have the chance to try some of the specialty brands before making a purchase.

You should be able to find a dealer that has Integra and others to try so you can compare/contrast.

On a personal note: I've found better amps/receivers can actually improve the sound of mediocre speakers. Of course it's awesome to match a great receiver with great speakers, but if you start with the receiver (good advice from DDeca)you may find your current speakers will get you by until you can demo and find the right speaker that works best for your needs.

BTW, Don't fall into the "specs" trap of purchasing based upon Watts. I've heard 50 Watt receivers outperform 110 watt receivers in both sound quality and how loud they play (unless you like to hear garbled junk really loud!) Not saying that you need less watts, just that you should demo if possible and judge based upon actual performance and specs. Do, however, make sure all the specs you need are available for connections, etc.

Good luck,

Mike

Thanks to all of you for your help. Another question I have is how will I know what sounds best when each dealer has differnt sound room configurations? It may sound great in the store but be much differnt when I get it home. Don't the room accoustics play a major role in determining how good a receiver and it's other components sound?

Yes Mitch, room accoustics are all important. Think of your equipment as the strings of a violin, and your room as the body. The trouble is you are now in an even higher price range. Someone with an SPL (sound pressure level) and an RTA (real time anylizer) will have to come and figure out your undesired surface reflections, etc... You will likely need accoustic wall treatments and maybe even a parametric equilizer. You could easily spend your budjet on accoustics.

I agree with DDeca, except that I might be inclined to buy the center speaker first. Don't forget to plan a good subwoofer for the future.

Nothing wrong with Onkyo's Integra line, but you might also look at the Yamaha, Denon and others in the same price range. At 1000 bucks or so, you have several decent options.

You cannot fairly guage speakers that are located in different rooms. You can however become intimately knowlegable on a particular piece of music, and take it with you in your search. You can also check out the listening rooms. If some effort has been put forth to make the various rooms accoustically correct, then the difference from room to room diminishes.

Aside from that, the timber, among other things, varies dramatically from speaker to speaker, and ultimately you are going to have to make a, dare I say, emotional decision.

Hope this stuff helps a little.

Yes, the room is going to affect sound quality as the others have mentioned. For arguments sake, take notice as to how the demo room sounds in comparision to your room at home. Talk to the salesperson in the room. Is it easy to hear them? hard to hear them? Does the conversation sound dull? Brite? Clap and see if you get echo, sharpness etc. At the least you can make your own assesment without bringing in sound testing equipment to the demo room!

After you hear something you like, ask the dealer if you can try it out at home. Or, do a blind test at a showroom. At least you have a starting point.

How about if you brought in your current receiver to a dealer? Then you can REALLY compare receivers.

Another good point is this: do you listen to 2 channel music on the system? If the answer is yes, then absolutely demo receivers as they all sound good for surround (in that $ range) but some will be MUCH better for good old stereo music. If you are 85% + for surround sound, then I would not be as critical for choosing the receiver.


Let us know how it goes...

Quite right Mike. If you can assertain the condition of the demo room, you can make a better decision about the speakers. The clap test can be quite helpful here.

It might be a bit much to ask for the dealer to wire in Mitch's old receiver, especially since we all know it's ancient history anyway. Everything is going to sound better.

Nothing effects sound quality as much as speakers. Buy a decent receiver, and be very careful selecting speakers.

It's going to boil down to what sounds better to you. It always does. If you buy on specs alone, you will be shooting yourself in the foot.

Happy hunting Mitch. Wish it was my turn to buy new speakers!

Well I guess I have some homework and window shopping to do. It might be a while before I make the dive, since I have only had this system for just over a year, and convincing the wife I need a better system is going to be a real chalange.

Maybe I will give my daughter my current system when she goes to college this coming fall. But then I wouldn't have anything. I would have to start from scratch and spend $1000.00's more.

Maybe I will win the lottery and then I won't have to convince the wife. If that happens it will be chump change in both our minds. Right! Like that's gonna happen!

What do you think of Infinity speakers for good budget speakers?

You should give these a try:

[Link: av123.com]

These are some of the best speakers for the money. The Onix Rockets have been very highly praised by most all publications and more importantly, by the audiophiles on many forums (most noteably, avsforum.com).

Contrary to what has been said earlier, I believe that speakers will make a much bigger difference in the sound than the receiver. Onkyo makes a decent receiver, so it's not like you're using some piece of crap receiver to begin with. If you MUST stay within $1500, then I would purchase the speakers listed above and then use whatever is left for the receiver. You could give the new Panasonic digital receiver a try. It's low cost but is also being highly praised for it's acoustics. I believe the model is the XR45.

Also, Pioneer makes a good receiver with an automatic setup utility that implements a parametric equalizer, time delay, and level balancing to automatically adjust the receiver to your room and speakers. You simply setup the included microphone at the listening position and hit the setup button. The receiver does the rest. This is a really nice feature, as room conditions usually dominate the sound that you hear. Take a look at it here:

[Link: ww3.onecall.com]

Hope that helps some,

Russell

With a sensitive speaker, the majority of the time, you are only using a few watts to power the speaker, so don't worry too much about wattage.