I had a similar situation with Time Warner (US). Was at a relative's house. They cancelled cable TV but wanted to keep the internet. They never returned the box, and were charged $5 per month to keep it, without a programming fee. It was just used for the Program Guide convienence.

Well, after 3-4 months they caught on. They were able to find out that cable was still being viewed. So instead of shutting it off, they just started charging for cable TV again, service that was never ordered!

It took quite a few conversations on the phone, but finally they admitted they should have shut off the service, not re-activated it. So we took the box back, and hooked the analog cable straight to the TV's tuner.

They still never shut it off, either! :-)

I have the Rogers extended basic cable tier. No premium content digital requiring a set top box. I get about 450 digital streams. I strongly suspect that those streams are ALWAYS on the cable and would be available if you have highspeed on that cable. The highspeed piggy-backs on the cable. I strongly doubt that Rogers specifically filters the cable when you just have highspeed. They do put on a bandpass filter to cut out the lower (analog) channels.

As to accessing those digital streams.....Section 326 of the Criminal Code has a heading: "Theft of Telecomminication Service".....which applies to you since you have stopped your cable tv service.

The actual status of the streams, when you do subscribe for cable services, but not for the premium set-top-box stuff, is unclear. But given that ATSC tuners have been available for some years, and the use of those tuners is *only* possible for reception of non-premium content, I think that Rogers cannot argue that those streams are NOT included in the subscription. It is only the premium content which is protected by the requirement of a further subscription.

I am a lawyer, but I was told many years ago at law school that criminal lawyers have to associate with liars, thieves and scoundrels, and that the clients are worse, so I don't do crim law....

Geoff

What are the definitions of "fraudulently, maliciously, or without colour of right" in the context of this law?

Given that every channel I will be using is publicly broadcast for free in their local area then the content itself should not fall under this guideline as I assume I do have the "colour of right" to receive any publicly aired broadcast. There is certainly no maliciousness in this context either, as I have simply left my equipment connected exactly as it was before my paid service was disconnected. I would expect there is no fraud here either as I haven't deceived anyone (if I installed an upstream blocking device, which I have realized I shouldn't even if I could, then that would be an act of deception) and am only making use of a service they've seen fit to provide me for free.

It's not illegal at all.

Illegal would be removing the filters outside your house. Or hacking a box. Just plugging a cable into a tuner is perfectly fine. It's their fault for not encrypting it.

"Fraudulently...without colour of right" means that you have NO legal right to it. The question was whether he could use the cable for the digital channels are discontinuing cable service. The answer is NO. That would be taking 'without color of right'. And *not* removing filters etc. has nothing to do with it.

As to whether you would get caught, that is a completely different question....But you are reading/posting here and it can be assumed that you are interested in the reception of digital television channels. You could email Rogers and ask. You might get an answer that amounts to 'we don't care. you have highspeed'. Then you could argue you have a colour of right because you relied upon the supplier (even if the 'help desk' was wrong.. (pity that that argument is not available when you are dealing with the government!)).

Further to this thread, I did a scan with a new piece of hardware and its scanning tool and it marked certain channel.serviceid's as 'Internet'...so it appears that the highspeed is carried as specific multiplexed streams in among the other streams.
Which affirmatively answers the question: are the digital streams still there?

New thread:
I am in Mississauga, near Clarkson. I did a scan and picked up new QAM256 channels (for me) at 85#85 and 85#87. The latter is clearly STAR at cable channel 278. The other has an ESPN logo in the top right and TSN in the bottom right.
And I am completely unable to determine what this is by looking at the TV listings at zap2it.com. I thought that it might be cable channel 407 or 408 (TSN feeds), but last night it had Nascar qualifying at Bristol, Tenn.. not listed in the guide..at all. Tonight, for example it had a tennis tournament, from Florida...Not in the guide for anywhere around here. I even tried 'changing' my address to 14201 (Buffalo) and selecting various cable suppliers there....No tennis tournaments...It's clearly an ESPN feed. At one point the tennis had ESPN VIVO in the logo. But what?

So can anyone else get 85#85? And if so, what is it?

Geoff

85.85 is a Rogers promotional channel on my list.

Yes I thought when I did the scan that 85#85 would be the Promo Channel. But that is recognizable at channel 124#1531. (the *other* promo?) I called the Promo I found cable channel 401 as that seemed the most likely place for it. I also found 2 Rogers on Demand channels (showing the same movie!).

Note that I am in Mississauga, and therefore the Etobicoke listing is what I get. For example, the music you list at 84 I get there too based on the PID's, but I get the radio streams on 64# not 96.
You get the sports channels on 78# I get them on 74# with the same PID's including the 2 CBC stations on the same multiplex.

That's what makes this new channel so weird. It does not seem to match *anything* known.

I've noticed that the PID/subchannels rarely change... a few things have moved around even on my list before, and they've always been easy to match up with their previous location since only the transmission channel changes.

Yes, there are two different promo stations, and sometimes one starts showing a different kind of promo... chances are very high that your 85.85 is the same as my 85.85. :-)

Well it turned out that 85#85 was one of the Sports Promo channels. I guess they were doing a free show promo for the Nascar channels through the afternoon Saturday, and another promo on Sunday, as I saw no commercials for Rogers premium content during the time I watched...

Another question then. I am having a lot of trouble matching the channel#pid for CFMT on cable channel 169. It's 'supposed' to be 111#1204 but that is an encrypted channel here in Mississauga.
Anyone out this way know what its actual channel and PID are? I cannot find it at all...
Geoff

Further question: Does anyone have or know of a site which maps cable channels to actual frequency plus PID numbers.. That is "what is cable channel 129 in 'tuner talk'", or "my tuner says it is 84#4, what is the channel"?

Geoff

Nope. But if you go into your Rogers cable box's diagnostics screen there might be some of that information (on a channel by channel basis).

Ahhm but that's the problem. I don't have a cable box. I'm using an HDHomeRun tuner from silicondust.com. As noted, it gives me 35 tv chanels and about 70 audio channels.. In fact, everything you list in your digital channels page....But not at the same places...Since I am in Mississauga. Luckily the PID's are generally all the same but it's still a puzzler.

It's hard to map them without a Rogers box around. It took me quite a while to make up the list even with a box. Especially with the various CTV/Global/CBC affiliates... and some that were often airing the same thing at the same time!