I have a C7 and a Pioneer receiver. The C7 remote has all the advanced functions I need to control this reciever EXCEPT for a code to cycle through the Dolby modes. I (and others) have tried possibly "all" the advanced functions using SETUP X X X codes to no avail.

My question is this... if the C7 controls all the functions EXCEPT this one particular button, why can't ALL functions of the receiver eventually be found on the C7 by using advanced functions? I got the impression that if you tried enough of the Advanced Function numbers, you would "hit" all the OBC codes from 0 - 256. How could the Pioneer NOT use one of these codes? It must be using 0 - 256 for all the OTHER buttons on the remote, right? Has Pioneer used some off-the-wall code for JUST THIS ONE BUTTON that the C7 simply cannot reproduce (except by Learning)? It doesn't make sense to me.

Like I said, just a stupid question... -Jack

The solution would be to learn this button into your C7. But that doesn't answer the question you actually asked.
It's possible that Pioneer used another device ID in the code for that button; many devices use multiple device ID's to encompass all their functions. If Rob's around, he can probably tell you right off whether this device does or not.
If you know someone with a Pronto or a JP1 box, they could analyze this IR signal for you and tell you the protocol, device ID, and the function code (EFC) for this device/button.

Also the Pioneer may use a new code for this button that wasn't in use when the C7 libary was created.

For my Toshiba TV I had to learn 2 buttons and for my Sony Receiver a lot. ( But I am having great fun trying to learn the surrnd button equivalent for Sony, and so is everyone else from what I can gather)

Jim Cruickshank

Jim, thanks for the reply. Part of my (clueless) reasoning goes like this... there are only 256 codes, right? How could Pioneer use a "new code" that wasn't from 0-256?

Let me ask another way. If I pressed SETUP 0 0 0 through SETUP 9 9 9, shouldn't the C7 eventually spit out (DEVICE_ID + OBC) where OBC were all the codes from 0-256? If so, it should eventually hit the OBC for the function in question (Surround sound mode). Unless, as Glenn pointed out, Pioneer would use a DIFFERENT DEVICE_ID for just that one function. Which begs another stupid question... WHY ON EARTH would a mfgr use TWO device IDs for one device, if they weren't using all 256 OBCs to begin with (they obviously aren't in this case).

I also have never heard anybody explain why UEI has to go through a weird table lookup between EFC and OBC. Why didn't they just use DEVICEID + (0-256) like the OBC codes themselves? Therefore, if the OBC for a function is 123, then you would press SETUP 1 2 3 for the advanced code.

(My opinion): The EFCs are a form of "encryption" that UEIC chose to slow down the people (competitors/hackers) that wanted to learn the tables of all the device codes and functions UEIC developed or acquired. The un-encrypted codes are stored inside the remote. The only reason for encrypting is to hide the obvious patterns of OBCs. Until people using Pronto and other remotes to see the actual IR signals, the UEIC codes were almost a trade secret. Now with the JP1 boxes, the remotes have become many times more personally customizable - you can set up each device with the buttons exactly as you wish, and can control devices that were omitted by the factory.