43 days to go goodie goodie new AMP

Who's arguing? It is a DISCUSSION!

LOL

JJP

"none of what was said above goes against daniel's rules for the forum…. but you can take my word (or go look for yourself) that there is no christmas or religion forum on this site."

ok then, here we go………


i consider myself 'unchurched' (not an agnostic, i believe there is a god, but i define him), unfortunately most people and religions today incorrectly assume that because someone chooses to be unchurched, and therefore does not attend a church, that they must be athiests. in actuality, the majority of the unchurched are very spiritual, yet don't want to give up control of one of the few remaining aspects of their life that by virtue of its innate personal nature should not be dictated by any other person or group.

the apostle paul had a great understanding of the unchurched. in acts 17:23-25 he says, "for as i was walking along i saw your many altars. and one of them had this inscription on it-'to an unknown god.' … god made this world and everything in it…he doesn't live in man-made temples…and human hands can't serve his needs. he himself gives life and breath to everything, and he satisfies his every need there is." now i know this is paraphrased, from one verson of many versions of the book called the bible, which itself is only a written version of oral histories handed down from generation to generation. in many differing languages and passing through many differing iterations.
ever played 'pass the secret'?

i think too many people rely on their religion's self appointed (or voted-in) chief cook & bottlewasher and/or the textbook of their religion: ok, he/it says to do this and it says to do that, so if i do this, this, and that, then i'm gonna go to heaven. and besides, if i do screw up, i can always renounce my sins and get in anyway.

i don't think it works that way. there must be some personal accounting for what you do along the way. there must be living checks & balances, concurrent with your life as you live it. not just an all encompassing 'ooops, i'm sorry' and everything goes away.

i talk to god every day. and no one can tell me how, when or where to talk to him. to find the spiritual means that will actually most benefit yourself, amidst the myriad of possibilities available requires resolve and discrimination in the sorting through of the many spiritual mediators extant between man and god. picking and choosing what feels best and most morally supportive of your view of spirituality requires much in the way of introspection and research. there are those that are spiritually sighted and are in a position to help, and we should not be too proud or hard-headed or individualistic so as to not look for and accept that help since what is at stake is our own happiness. just keep in mind that there are many such resources.

there are aspects of all the major religions that i incorporate into my own personal belief system. i draw on the generalities of each and seek specific knowledge from each. and i'm always looking for new insights as well. your view could be one of them. life is an ongoing and continual learning process.

1) buddhism: the only peace one can attain is from completely not being, thus no afterlife of any sort.
2) hinduism: like buddhism it believes in moksha, but it differs in that it teaches that peace comes from an eternal tie with brahma, thus allowing an eternal life of sorts.
3) sikhism: appears to want to blend those two religions without committing to one or the other.
4) confucianism: on the surface,this appears to be more of a philosophy than a religion and seems to state simply that confucius molded his philosophy purely for a secular and political purpose, strictly speaking, there is no spirituality in confucianism.
5) jainism: unlike other religions, jainism finds absolutely no possible way of justifying the taking of any life, for any reason and places man in the role of shepard of the universe.
6) judaism: the main difference between the jews and the christians are that the jews reject the idea that jesus is the son of god. while worshipping the very same god.
7) christianity: believes god took an earthly form in the body of jesus christ.
8) islam: believes jesus was simply a prophet of god, but not god. while still worshipping the very same god as the jews and christians


the western religions view of god holds that man is an evil sinner, born in sin dying in sin, the most loathsome entity god ever created. with this view many western religions base themselves on the guilt imposed by this view. with this influence western religion has become a conglamoration of faiths with incredible and deep control over their adherents lives. to the western religions, man is a sinner with only one opportunity to alleviate this burden, salvation. heaven just means having to say youre sorry.

the various branches of the hindu faith have an equal amount of control over their believers, but with a far different message. the eastern philosophies in general view man as having an infinite potential of becoming great. for example the caste system of hinduism states that a person is born into a certain level, but by doing good, it is possible to uplift oneself and become better. this potential for greatness that hinduism holds is in sharp contrast to the portrayal of man as the evil sinner that the western religions maintain. of course, this uplifting may require many, many attempts, and many, many lives, returning again and again as just about any creature on the earth.

all religions believe they are in some form "god's chosen." the jews, the christians, muslims, hindus, sikhs, etc. all believe their respective paths are the right ones. but each holds a different view of their rights as the chosen and how anyone not adhering to those beliefs is treated. all, in some way, believe god chose humans to stand out, some believe this gives us the right to basically do whatever we choose to whatever other species we choose to do it to, while others contend that as the chosen we have the responsibility not to exploit but to protect, to live in cooperation with other species.

for example the basic belief of western religions is that man is a creature of more divine origins than any other creature on earth. and that because he is this divine creature, this universe and all that is in it, plants, animals, etc. are at his disposal, to exploit as he sees fit. this arrogant philosophy can be seen everyday by the way animals are mass produced only to go to the slaughter house to feed our hungers or how we gobble up all of the natural resources and lands leaving little to nothing for the natural inhabitants.

eastern religions see humans as having the potential to exploit, but that it is our responsibility to live in harmony with nature. taking this belief even further, the jainist belief states that as the chosen species, man has an incredible responsibility. we are to be the protector of our environment, our position in the universe tasks our strengths and superiority in aiding other creatures not maiming them, preserving and enriching the universe for future generations.

your choice is your choice, plain and simple. my choice is mine as well. i choose to be the shepard of my own personal spirituality.

anyways………that's my .02……(or would that maybe be .20)? either way my fingers are tired and my brain is beginning to feel numb. i think i'll take a break and go talk to a sheep, might be god....who knows?.

(the views expressed here are my own......yours may -and probably do- differ. thats what makes life so interesting.)



'best wishes for an environmentally conscious, socially responsible, low stress, non-addictive, gender-neutral, winter solstice holiday, practiced within the most joyous traditions of the religious persuasion of your choice, but with respect for the religious persuasion of others who choose to practice their own religion as well as those who choose not to practice any religion at all.'

star in your name?! / talk of christmas....... you are the new chosen one "Star of the unchurched and other simon templers " I bow to the new king/queen for as the new messiah says best wishes to gender-neutral i will not practice your new religion i will do it for real so i will do both of the new greats ones last sentence instructions

this is what i imagine star50fiveoh looks like

close but no cigar.
i think you should study with your art instructor some more.

GODS bless the meek who shal inherit RC in the future?

you have many faces oh great star one .my image was one of Zeus king of the gods now after studying your picture i have seen the error of my ways but its hard to surf down the manchester ship canal with all those shopping trolleys in it.oh great lord

Sir,

The passage you quoted from Acts describes Paul's visit to Athens. The people of Athens at that time were incredibly superstitous, and erected statues to all known Gods of the day. In case they missed one, they erected a statute to the Unknown God, kind of a catch-all, CYA kind of thing. In a very nice way, Paul was in a sense mocking them, for he knew there was only one true God. Read the rest of the chapter. Further in your comments, you survey world religions in a cafeteria style, i.e. pick the one you want (or whatever combination), and, for you, that will be the true religion. The passage from Acts you quote actually serves to discredit the remainder of your post. God does not mold himself to your definition, nor mine. He simply is. ("I AM" was a name he referred to himself as.)

True, there are many religions and beliefs existing today. However, since they contradict each other, the rules of simple logic dictate that it is impossible for them all to be correct. Can we agree on that, at least? To say that all religions are true if they are believed by someone is ridiculous from the premise. This is Moral Relativism, which implies that there are no truth absolutes (true or false). Rather, truth is defined culturally - that is, if we all agree something is true, then it must be true.

In fact, there ARE absolutes. There are five very strong arguements against Moral Relativism. Rather than listing them here, I will instead encourage you to read Love God With All Your Mind by J.P. Moreland. This book presents compelling arguements to many of your misconceptions, and points you to the answers you seek.

Today, more than ever before, it is vital for a Christian to also be an Apologetic, an intellectual defender of the faith. While I am a Christian, I am also an American and a firm believer in the Bill of Rights. I don't persecute non-Christians - I just accept it as their constitutional right to be wrong.

Of course, being a Christian is more than just the intellectual acceptance of the truth of the Bible - it is the act of yielding your will to the will of God. THAT's the hard part for a lot of people.

As an aside, your implication that scripture could fundamentally change through a "pass the secret" scheme would, if applied to the Koran, result if a death sentence for you. Ask Salman (sp?) Rushdie, the author of Santanic Verses. Although the King James version was translated from the original Hebrew, Greek and Arabic to Latin, THEN to English, it is amazingly similar to, say, the New American Standard version, which was translated directly from the original (Dead Sea Scrolls, etc.) into contemporary English. Rather than assume it was translated incorrectly, we are left to marvel at the hand of God. Sixty-six books written over several hundred years by so many people - yet resulting in an amazingly cohesive book detailing hundreds of fullfilled prophesies spanning centuries while explaining in simple terms unfathomable truthes. The validity of the Bible does not rest simply within the Bible (i.e. "the Bible says it, I believe it, and that's that"), but abundantly outside of the Bible as well. The proof of the existance of God is all around you.

One thing you said that I completely agree with is your statement that one does not have to attend church to be a believer. Its just easier, because you can commit more time to a structured study regime (it's a life-time kind of thing), and there are more opportunities to witness (some) good examples of what you aspire to be.

My Dear Reader, my advice to you is not to find a religion that you like, but to find the religion that is true. I encourage you to learn about all the religions noted in the post above, but for the purpose of determining what is true and what is not true. You cannot take a cafeteria approach (one of these, one of those). Don't just take my word for it - do your own research. Take your time and do it right - there is a lot at stake here.

Thank you for my $.02 opportunity, and God Bless You All! And, please, no "XMASS". Don't take the "Christ" out of Christmas!

WHERES THE LIONS?

no winners or losers here, just differing opinions.

Good the sabeth today love and peace to one and all

3 DAYS LEFT TO GO

deux