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following fred's lead: a checklist to qualify cable installers?
This thread has 37 replies. Displaying posts 1 through 15.
Post 1 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 16:31
juliejacobson
CE Pro Magazine
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So, if a consumer or builder is going to hire an installer for structured wiring (let's keep it focused for now), what are the key questions to ask? How do you REALLY qualify someone? We've run stories in Electronic House (consumer) and TecHome Builder (builders) about how to hire a pro, but it would be great to get much more detail and create some marketing materials around it, focusing SPECIFICALLY on structured wiring, then perhaps following up with other disciplines.

There will be issues that will be controversial, such as certain certifications (CEDIA, etc.) but it would be great to hash those out here, too.

I'll start with the first question for the checklist, then hopefully others will chime in, editing the questions, asking new ones, etc., and i'll try to keep a running list.

Qualification Questions to Ask Your Structured Wiring Installer

1. Do you label your wires? (need some input on a more detailed question--like how do you label your wires...)
"CEPro: your website sucks!" - Fins
www.cepro.com
[Link: twitter.com]
Post 2 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 16:42
Fred Forlano
Long Time Member
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Yay! I'm the subject of a post and it's not about how stupid I am!!!!

Start with the basics:

1) Are you LICENSED by the STATE and/or LOCAL government to do low-voltage electrical work. If not, why not?

-- Being a licensed contractor brings many factors into consideration. It indicates this person is compliant with the state as a legitimate person working in the field. This person has passed educational criterea[sp] deemed important to the scope of work done encompassed by the license holder. It also indicates that the person is willing to have their record scrutinized and not afraid to hide anything in their past.

2) Are you INSURED with both WORKMAN'S COMPENSATION and LIABILITY? How much coverage for each?

-- Having adequate insurance for yourself and your workers is a law (except where the law allows for exemptions). It is designed to protect the worker AND THE CLIENT should an injury happen on the jobsite. Proper insurance is also an indicator that the person/contractor is legit and not trying to skate by under the radar.

Liability Insurance is designed to protect the company should there be any damage to the customer's personal property or home during any phase of the project. By having liability insurance, you are showing your customers that you are covered and are going to take care of any issue that should arise as a result of your work, either direct or indirect. For example, if one of your workers were to drop a screwdriver on a wood floor and scratch the floor, the repair expense could be costly. Liability insurance would cover the repair cost.

3) Are you BONDED?

-- Many people don't bother to get bonded, but they should. It states that if you are unable to/unwilling to fulfil your end of the contract, the customer is not stuck. The bond will ensure that the job is completed by another contractor to fulfil the original scope of work.

That should get you started. I know there are many places that don't REQUIRE licensing, but that doesn't mean it's not a good idea to BE licensed...

Fred

Last edited by Fred Forlano on July 16, 2006 17:05.
"I have been marked once, my dear and let me assure you, no needle shall ever touch my skin again." -- Erik Magnus Lensherr (Magneto)
OP | Post 3 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 16:52
juliejacobson
CE Pro Magazine
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Treasure the moment, Fred.

Would also include what the "correct" answers should be. In other words, the question, then an explanation of why the question is important to ask, and what some of the "right" answers would be.

Once we've honed this list, I will commit to its being published in our consumer and builder pubs and websites.
"CEPro: your website sucks!" - Fins
www.cepro.com
[Link: twitter.com]
Post 4 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 17:13
Brentm
Ethereal Home Theater
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2,688
Add to Freds List.
4) Will you provide proper documentation for all of the above?
5) Do you have references of similar jobs?
Brent McCall
Paid Endorser for;
Ethereal (386) 846-7264 Cell
Post 5 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 17:18
Fred Forlano
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On July 16, 2006 at 17:13, Brentm said...
Add to Freds List.
4) Will you provide proper documentation for all
of the above?
5) Do you have references of similar jobs?

References don't really account for much. ANYONE can produce 3 customers who will say they're wonderful. Of course, if you CAN'T come up with three for the form.....

Fred
"I have been marked once, my dear and let me assure you, no needle shall ever touch my skin again." -- Erik Magnus Lensherr (Magneto)
OP | Post 6 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 17:22
juliejacobson
CE Pro Magazine
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On July 16, 2006 at 17:13, Brentm said...
Add to Freds List.
4) Will you provide proper documentation for all
of the above?

What would comprise "proper" documentation?

Is the best approach for a checklist to simply list these questions, then put onus on dealers to define their own proper documentation and let consumer be the judge?
"CEPro: your website sucks!" - Fins
www.cepro.com
[Link: twitter.com]
Post 7 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 17:29
Fred Forlano
Long Time Member
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On July 16, 2006 at 17:22, juliejacobson said...
What would comprise "proper" documentation?

Is the best approach for a checklist to simply
list these questions, then put onus on dealers
to define their own proper documentation and let
consumer be the judge?

As part of the checklist, after each question, I'd put (Please provide appropriate license/insurance/bond) information and/or documentation. I post all of mine on my website, and update it whenever it warrants. Anyone who isn't willing to provide a potential client with that information should be a RED FLAG to that client.

Fred
"I have been marked once, my dear and let me assure you, no needle shall ever touch my skin again." -- Erik Magnus Lensherr (Magneto)
Post 8 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 17:35
augsys
Long Time Member
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442
On July 16, 2006 at 17:18, Fred Forlano said...
References don't really account for much. ANYONE
can produce 3 customers who will say they're wonderful.
Of course, if you CAN'T come up with three for
the form.....

Fred

I think this is question one, passing a test and paying a fee does not ensure you do good work, doing good work for past clients is a much better indicator.

My short reference list is two pages with twenty five clients, the long one has sixty.
http://www.gmillerdesigns.com/ Propose-Design-Program

http://integrationpros.org Where the Pros Go!
Post 9 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 17:50
limelightsystems
Long Time Member
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September 2005
137
I hate to say it but Licenses and Certifications mean little. I have both BTW and I know many licensed guys who have no right doing what they do, and now @DI is offering Cedia certification classes. I think the refrences mean more personally.
Post 10 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 17:53
The Lizardking
Long Time Member
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355
Are there a previous jobs that can be seen? I don't know that I would trust just pictures, you can get them anywhere.
I am the lizardking I can do anything
Post 11 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 18:42
Brentm
Ethereal Home Theater
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2,688
On July 16, 2006 at 17:53, The Lizardking said...
Are there a previous jobs that can be seen? I
don't know that I would trust just pictures, you
can get them anywhere.

Yes: I once saw a picture from a job that I had done (published) in a magazine ad for a small dist. (unknown).
Brent McCall
Paid Endorser for;
Ethereal (386) 846-7264 Cell
Post 12 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 19:46
doopid
Active Member
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559
Hold on a moment...

So if a company has:

-A licence (pay a fee to the local municipality)
-Have insurance (overpay an insurance company a category they don't have for what you do)
-Get bonded (accumulate some money from previous jobs)...

What happended to being capable of actually doing the job?

Technically, all companies need these three documents.

During construction of my home (I was project manager): the plumber, HVAC, framer, tile and electrician were all thrown off the job because they were all unable to even spell their own name. Mind you, they all had the proper documentation.

For the record, I am now a master plumber, (metaphorically speaking),no desire to knock tin, I can swing a hammer and hit stuff with it like a pro, electrify anything, and lay tile like a western european.

I think 'word of mouth' is the best policy.
A fine is a tax for doing wrong. A tax is a fine for doing well.
Post 13 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 21:45
geraldb
Long Time Member
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June 2002
412
Please define "Structured Wiring"
That is probably the loosest name I have ever heard. Ask 5 different people and you will get 5 different answers.

I have told my guys that if they use that term, they would be entitled to a permanent vacation!
Post 14 made on Sunday July 16, 2006 at 22:07
doopid
Active Member
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Posts:
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559
I understood 'structured wiring' to be a generic term...in the same way people use the 'home theater' term.

Kinda makes you squirm.
A fine is a tax for doing wrong. A tax is a fine for doing well.
Post 15 made on Monday July 17, 2006 at 00:18
TouchCommander
Active Member
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Posts:
December 2004
602
As always it seems simple to define something, but then the gray area appears. In California an Arizona you have to be bonded along with license. In 30 years I have never seen a bond company pay out. In Arizona we have to Pay into a recovery fund which the home owner can use if the contractor quits or goes under. Sounds Great!!!
But here's how it works. If you can wait a year to go through the proper channels, then you can collect your monies up to $100,000. If you go to court first, then the state won't give you the money. It gets better, if you are one of many trying to get your money, then it becomes a first there, first served on the day that the state releases the money. Contractors license. Go to license school for the weekend, pass test. What do you know about LV??? My point. Referral, referral, referral. I have worked with some great contractors that were just to lazy to get license.
No job to small, many to big
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