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Topic:
Funny story about satellite guy
This thread has 38 replies. Displaying posts 31 through 39.
Post 31 made on Thursday May 25, 2006 at 07:26
davidcasemore
Super Member
Joined:
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January 2003
3,352
On May 25, 2006 at 07:04, oex said...
wrong. i dare you do go grab a spark plug wire
with your car running and come back and continuie
this conversation. better yet grab one in each
hand as to have the current path thru your heart,
Ber smart, call 911 in advance.

wrong again. go grab a 12v battery full charged.
wet your hands to get the full effect. A car
battery can supply 2000+ amps easily. it will
barely tingle unless you douse yourself with salt
water.

Well, you're wrong. It was (maybe still is) very common for a science teacher to take a coil from a car and shock students ti demonstrate the difference between voltage and current. Grabbing the spark plug will hurt, but won't kill you. Spark plug wires have very thin conductors (very little current) and very thick insulation (very high voltage)

And, you're wrong again. You don't understand the difference between AVAILABLE current and CURRENT FLOW. Take the positive wire off of the car battery. Hold it in your right hand. Put your left hand on the positive battery terminal. Then have someone turn the ignition key. Bye-bye.
Fins: Still Slamming' His Trunk on pilgrim's Small Weenie - One Trunk at a Time!
Post 32 made on Thursday May 25, 2006 at 07:32
davidcasemore
Super Member
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3,352
On May 24, 2006 at 23:36, Trunk-Slammer -Supreme said...
| With AC, the voltage is not what can kill you,
it's the amperage (supposedly it takes at least
1 amp to kill?).

True. Up to a point. Extremely high voltages can burn you and can even amputate an arm or leg. All without high current flow.

And my meter says a telephone line goes to 90
volts on ring, although the amperage is still
measured in millivolts.

True again. The amperage will be determined by the number of telephones in the house. (Measured in REN)
Fins: Still Slamming' His Trunk on pilgrim's Small Weenie - One Trunk at a Time!
Post 33 made on Thursday May 25, 2006 at 10:36
Ted Wetzel
Founding Member
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November 2001
879
So to sum it all up. The chances of getting killed by electricution (sp?) are pretty damn small. But don't think it can't happen because it's "low voltage". Pay attention to how you are inadvertantly grounding yourself. And never assume anything. I have one first hand accound of a coax that had 120V AC on it from an over zealous drywall screw and a poorly run piece of NM-B.

I also have one first hand account of a contractor that I know of seriously electricuting himself while trying to replace a 200amp panel without pulling the meter. He lived to tell about it. Didn't even need a trip to the hospital. But he looked like something out of a sci-fi movie aftwerwards.
Post 34 made on Thursday May 25, 2006 at 10:57
Springs
Super Member
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3,238
Electrictian on a Ladder... working down stairs on the lighting. Power goes out in the house... first thought... he knicked something.

Walk down stairs to find him lying on the ground missing the hair on his arm and big hole thorugh his shoe.

Least resistance to ground. He doesn't work anymore. Just collects disability/comp according to the builder.
Post 35 made on Thursday May 25, 2006 at 11:26
Steve Garn
Senior Member
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1,319
On May 24, 2006 at 23:58, davidcasemore said...
No Ed, you're right. A phone is (about) 48 volts
DC. When a call comes in, the Telco sends (about)
90 volts AC to the ringer. If you are working
on a live phone line, it's best to take a phone
off hook. That way, since nobody can call, the
90 volts AC will never be sent.

I found this out in an attic in July (in Phoenix) sweating from head to toe. The moment I faintly heard the phone ring I nearly fell thru. Some things in life just aren't fair..

Funny, when we were kids we had this silly prank where we'd call some unassuming adult telling them we were from the Telco working on the lines and that they shouldn't answer the phone for 15 minutes so our guy wouldn't get electricuted (of course in our deepest grownup voice at age 10). We'd call right back, they'd pick up and we'd scream bloody murder and then hang up. ...ha.

Now I think I understand why my mom was always telling me to go play outside.
Manuals?! We don't need no stinking manuals! a.. er..
Post 36 made on Thursday May 25, 2006 at 13:17
diesel
Senior Member
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April 2004
1,177
On May 24, 2006 at 12:39, tschulte said...
Okay, Mike, you are making us Missourians look
bad. Was this guy from Arkansas or just the Ozarks?

Okay, funny story that my guys love to bring up
all the time. When I first went into business
I had a partner that knew nothing. Once I got
rid of him I worked by myself for a couple of
months before hiring some guys.. During this
time I learned to work on the phones after disconnecting
from the demarc. But I never thought the shock
was that bad. So we are doing a basement finish
one day, and one of my guys dares the other to
touch the phone lines to his tongue. I start
laughing and tell them I will do it. "It is about
the same shock as a 9 volt battery." were the
famous last words. Well just as I touch the wires
to my tongue they must have been getting a call
because it hurt so bad I saw spots. My tongue
immediatley dried out and I had the taste of copper
in my mouth all day.

Moral of the story, don't assume you know more
than your guys.

I've had this happen too. I didn't have my strippers on me and was in a hurry. I forgot I had already hooked up to the d-mark. Had one conductor on my tongue and the other on my lip when it hit me. Just like you I saw the spots and my legs pretty much fell out from under me. I've been hit by 110 plenty of times, but the phone line was way worse.
Post 37 made on Thursday May 25, 2006 at 13:44
Theaterworks
Founding Member
Joined:
Posts:
April 2002
1,898
On May 25, 2006 at 10:36, Ted Wetzel said...
I also have one first hand account of a contractor
that I know of seriously electricuting himself
while trying to replace a 200amp panel without
pulling the meter. He lived to tell about it.
Didn't even need a trip to the hospital. But
he looked like something out of a sci-fi movie
aftwerwards.

Stupid is a stupid does, Forrest says.
Carpe diem!
Post 38 made on Thursday May 25, 2006 at 14:03
Ernie Bornn-Gilman
Yes, That Ernie!
Joined:
Posts:
December 2001
30,104
I mentioned a pamphlet named "The Fatal Current" above. Variations of this old pamphlet exist all over the place. Check out

[Link: codecheck.com]

and

[Link: physics.ohio-state.edu]

and especially

[Link: colorado.edu]

That last one is GREAT because it talks about conditions in a college lab. Our work conditions are often similar or less safe than a college lab, so this should be required reading.

On May 25, 2006 at 07:26, davidcasemore said...
Well, you're wrong. It was (maybe still is) very
common for a science teacher to take a coil from
a car and shock students ti demonstrate the difference
between voltage and current. Grabbing the spark
plug will hurt, but won't kill you.

It could conceivably kill you, but the current will kill you, not the voltage. Remember that for any given resistance, increasing the voltage will increase the current (if the current is available). So more current will flow through you from a high voltage source than from a lower voltage source. The exact results in this case are complicated by the fact that spark coils CAN'T put out much current.

Spark plug
wires have very thin conductors (very little current)
and very thick insulation (very high voltage)

But more to the point, the spark coil can't put out much current.


And, you're wrong again. You don't understand
the difference between AVAILABLE
current and CURRENT
FLOW. Take the positive wire off of the car battery.
Hold it in your right hand. Put your left hand
on the positive battery terminal. Then have someone
turn the ignition key. Bye-bye.

This is ludicrous. Let's say your body resistance is somewhere around 10,000 ohms. It's in that range unless you are wet and/or salty. If you follow the above instructions, you will be putting 10,000 ohms in series with the car battery. Without your body in the circuit, the extremely low resistance of the starter motor will cause hundreds of amps to be drawn. Once your 10,000 ohms are added to the circuit, NOTHING will happen when the ignition is turned. With 10,000 ohms in series with the extremely low resistance of the starter motor, about 12 volts divided by 10,000, or about 0.12 milliamps, will flow through your body and the starter motor. Actually, that 0.12 mA won't be enough current for the starter relay to engage, so the starter motor won't be in the circuit at all.
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 39 made on Thursday May 25, 2006 at 14:07
FRR
Advanced Member
Joined:
Posts:
June 2003
918
On May 25, 2006 at 02:50, Ernie Bornn-Gilman said...
I've seen the spec for ring as 120 volts, 20 Hz.

AT&T spec is 88v, 20Hz.

It's also another reason why low voltage licenses (in those locations that require low volt licenses) are described as for systems with 90v or less. The 90v is the demark point between high and low voltage systems. However, the ringing voltage can be as high as 130v or as low as 40v depending on the distances and loads (telephones) on a given telephone line.
Logic is a systematic method of coming to the wrong conclusion with confidence.
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