We have one of each... 1 Ford E250 Van, 1 Ford E350 Box Truck (with liftgate), 1 Ford F-550 Crew Cab with a box and a liftgate, and just got a Freightliner Sprinter on the road a couple of months ago. I will try to post pics later.

Agree with Stew about the Sprinter... We bought the Heavy Duty/Medium length/High top, and I wish we had the extra 18" +/- of the long wheelbase, but it's still great... The install staff still considers it a lesser sibling to Big Red, but it is still pretty big. I figure out this kind of stuff for a living, and I can't figure out the freakin' locks! I even (perish the thought) read the manual... $250/extra key is a kick in the ass too... 120 for the non-remote type... I spent a lot of time on the shelving and drawers, and I'll take some pics...

What is the issue with the Sprinter locks??

Depending on how deep the Mercedes heritage truly goes, it may use vacuum for the locks instead of DC. This used to give alarm guys fits, but these days any good alarm guy knows how to make one door lock actuator automate an entire MB with a keyless or alarm.

DJNorm, did you shop the Freightliner vs. the sprinter? Curious on the differences between the two - price, features, options.

Can a Sprinter/Freightliner tow a closed trailer?

I have a GMC2500 HD Crewcab shortbed pickup as my dailer driver and work truck. Works okay as I have loading down to a science (amazing how much stuff will fit in the back of the cab with the rear seats folded down). I think my next purchase though will be a closed trailer. Outfit it how you guys outfit your vans, tow it to the sight, leave it there for the week or whatever then tow it back home at the end of the job. Seems like a lot of trades are going that way now.

But the Freightliner/Sprinter keeps pulling me back...

I didn't shop it, the boss did... we didn't look at the Dodge, I don't think... Our local Freightliner dealer is horrible... We ended up buying it in NJ, and having it serviced here.

The locks are controlled by a single rocker switch on the console. the front half of the switch is supposed to control all of the locks, and the back half of the switch is supposed to work only the locks in the 'cargo area'. There are two LEDs on the switch shaped like little arrows. The one facing forward tells you the condition of the cab locks ( on if both locked, flashing if open, off if either or both is unlocked.) The one facing backward is for the cargo area. (same LED setup). Already, there is one confusion... the front of the switch controls ALL locks, but the LED that is pointing forward is only for the cab locks. If some of the locks are open and some are closed, you never know which way the switch will work... It may open the closed ones, and it may close the open ones... Haven't figured out a rhyme or reason yet... Usually takes two presses to get them to do what you want (given the Murphy principle).

The remote keyfob lock release is even worse ( if you can imagine that!) It has 'discrete codes' (Ha Ha) for unlock and lock. You would think that it would open all the locks and close all of the locks depending on which you press, right? Well, German engineers strike again! 'Lock' seems to work pretty reliably, but ' unlock', I don't get it! If you press unlock, the driver's door will unlock (most of the time) If you press it again immediately, nothing will happen. If you wait about 3 seconds and press it again, it will unlock more doors, but you never know whether just the passenger door, or both the passenger and the cargo area will open. Needless to say, I find myself walking up to the back door, pressing Open, waiting three seconds, and pressing it again, only to have nothing happen. Now I think, well, maybe I didn't wait the three seconds, and I try again. Nothing. If I try again, it's 50/50, and usually I end up just putting the key in and opening it. The problem is that I'm a pretty smart guy, and I HATE to let it get the better of me, so I keep trying every time I drive it (which isn't every day...) instead of just giving up...

Rant off, but you did ask!

Norm

PS still a cool truck, anyway...

Oh man, those locks sound like they would drive me nuts too.

My little Chevy Blazer does that to me.
One press id driver's door, second press is everything else...
Sometimes.

Usually I grab the hatch handle, give it a hearty tug, and nearly rip my fingernails off (OUCH) because the hatch is still locked.

Now I keep pressing the button until I hear the "chunk" sound for the driver's door, then the other doors, and then press it a few more times to hear the little "click, click" on the next couple presses.

I HATE OEM locks!! my last car had an aftermarket alarm with a 1/4 mile range starter and it worked like a champ.

It was also a Japanese sedan with a straightforward lock system and not a POS GM vehicle with over-engineered "smart" logic trinkets intended to think for you... take that for what it's worth.

A couple of things to add. My Savanna gets about 15mpg even with the AWD and an unloaded curb weight of about 6500 lbs. Twice what the old ford got. The GM van was a completely new chassis in (I think) '02 with the AWD coming out in '03 and has MAJOR improvements in all areas from the previous generation and IMO major improvements over the Ford. for those of you pulling a trailer there is a switch on the dash that reprograms the engine/trans programming for hauling a heavy load. The AWD is really nice. You will not get this truck stuck and have to be pulled out of a muddy construction site.

I hate the "intelligent" dome lights that turn off just when you are reaching into the truck. Plan on putting some good lights in the back of the thing.

Sprinter locks - My audi "remembers" what doors were open last time, when you take the key out of the ignition it opens only those doors. Maybe the Spriinter is doing some sort of modified version of that and doing it poorly.

Mercedes cars are below Kia on the reliability scale right now. Hopefully the trucks are better.

Has anyone thought of taking advantage of GM's current financial situation???

[Link: gm.com]

You can get a new GM for about 30% off. Gosh seeing that 46K Avalanche for 33K makes one closser to my driveway

Well that's pretty much what I did except I did actually get the GM employee price. MSRP on a fully loaded GMC Savana AWD was about 32K. I paid about 22K and this thing is loaded including HEATED MIRRORS and HEATED REAR GLASS. About the only thing I didn't get was the rear heat and AC. So based on that I figure you could get a regular 2500HD with a few bells and wistles for about 18K. It will take a LOT of gas to bring that up to 40K for a sprinter.

The fuel efficiency of the sprinter is only one area where it is superior to the Ford and Chevy. Work efficiency of the Sprinter is another area where there is a hidden labor savings. We have a 140" high roof model, and this thing is much easier to load, unload and keep organized than our E-350. Two pairs of guys start packing from the same jobsite at the end of the day, the guys driving the sprinter leave on average of 10-15 minutes sooner than those driving the Ford. This happens even when the crews swap vehicles. Doesn't sound like much, but look at the math:

2 men x .25 hr/day x 5 day x 50 weeks = 125 hours in a work year.
Our raw labor cost is in the neighborhood of $35/hr

$35 x 125 = $4375

Even if the number is only 7 minutes of savings, that's still $2k savings on a yearly basis. Add the fuel savings and the choice is clear.

Maybe I'm missing something.

I would really like to see this when it's done...
Please post those pics into this thread.

(I'm saving it as a favorite thread now)

actually I'd say the math is pretty good, although I'd drop a few weeks off of that total. I'd also have to factor in what kind of miles the truck would see each year. 500,000 miles doesn't do you much good if it takes 20 years to get there. And given that there is still a huge price difference between the vehicles and if your financing that extra 20K that's a lot of money as well.

For myself I pretty confident that I'll get close to 200,000 miles out of this truck before it's no longer something I want to own and it's also my everyday personal vehicle so that did have an effect on what I decided to buy. The truck drives well, runs well and with my custom racks is pretty efficient to work out of. It's also pretty easy to maneuver but this matters to some and not to others. All depends on what kind of area you've got to get into. I know some companies that won't use anything larger than a minivan for that exact reason.

But I've liked the idea of a sprinter install van since I first saw the FedEx trucks running around and based on what I've read here I'll certainly look at them next time I need a vehicle.

I am awaiting the A Class from Mercedes to be imported into the US.

Whether or not it would make sense for a service vehicle remains to be seen, but any car that gets 60+MPG is alright in my book...



It looks to be about the size of my old Civic Hatchback, and I loaded TONS of hi-fi gear and 4' and 6' stepladders into that thing the time I had it. I just had to be creative about folding the seats down.

i used to have a merc a class in my last job... i wasnt a big fan of it at all. (except like you say, in its economy)

if you were involved in accident in one of these (god forbid you're not) and the front of the vehicle takes the impact there's a high chance that you'll be needing a leg brace or two for a while.

they seem front heavy to drive aswell - so if you have occasion to stand on the brakes the back end feels light

but, on the plus side, for the size of the car they're good little 'city cars' small on the outside big on the inside (can fit 4 adults no problem - and im 6'2") and quick enough to handle the motorway at 70mph in relative comfort (albeit the seats feel a little low budget)

over here the mitisi pickup trucks seem to do well, the turbo diesel model returns a respectable 40mpg if memory serves me right

mind you, i saw one of those godawful rapper-mobiles over the weekend, some moron in a hummer... in yellow with those vile chrome 'spinner' wheels. doing about 5 mpg. far too large a vehicle for english roads and far too uneconomical - frankly i find it obscene! anyway.. rant over.

Jonathan

I felt the same way about my Civic HB until I saw some dumb girl standing next to the same car and crying to a trooper after she piled it up nto the back of a truck.

I would have thought for sure that nobody survived that type of damage, but I guess the crumple zones and safety cages are engineered in especially well on those little buggers. I would imagine MB has this down better than anyone except maybe Volvo.

Hi all,

I mentioned a while back that I was going to post pics and a review of our sprinter, well, here you go.








Vehicle:
Freightliner Sprinter 140" wheelbase with high roof. We chose Freightliner because they have a 24 hour 365 day service department. The unit we got has all of the power options (heated mirrors are great in rainy climes). Fuel mileage has been steady at 19-21mpg.

I was a bit leery of the capability of a 2.7 liter five cylinder Turbodiesel in a vehicle this size before I drove it. I can assure you that this powerplant is plenty even with a pretty decent load of wire and gear in the back. Top speed is electronically limited to 83 mph, and it gets there plenty fast.

Many people have commented about how the Sprinter looks like it is going to topple over. I am a pretty aggressive driver, and have found it to be very stable.

This is a 2005 model, and you might notice the factory alloy wheels. I was very pleased to see these on there as opposed to the ugly stamped steel ones of the earlier models. As you can see, appearance is something we take very seriously. All of our vehicles are a reflection on our company and the work we do.

One thing we were vey happy to find was that the electrical fuses are under the driver's seat. They even provided a nifty connecting block under there for attaching electrical accessories without having to run them through the firewall. There is a fixed bulkhead behind the passenger compartment that makes the air conditioning operate very efficiently, and keeps the cabin relatively quiet.

Do not underestimate the convenience of being able to actually walk around upright in the cargo compartment. It makes for a much more efficient operation during loading and unloadling. The step on the rear bumper is at a nice height, and provides plenty of traction.

Ladder Rack:
Leggett & Platt dual side power rack. This was a tough choice financially, but taking into consideration the weight of a 32' ladder, the rack is about 9' high, and the installer that drives this vehicle is 5'4", it made sense. To raise or lower the rack takes about ten seconds. I would purchase this item again in a heartbeat. No more screwing around with bungie cords or tie downs, and it lets rainwater run off of the ladders when you lower it. The metal fabrication is top notch, and I expect this to last for a long time.

Interior Racks :
System Edstrom. These green racks came from Sweden, and have excellent build quality. On the left side, I ordered a modification on their "CATV Installer" package. This is very similar to a shelving/cabinet system that you would order from the domestic manufacturers. We just laid it out so that our tools, etc. would fit ideally. On the right, you will see what they refer to as their "Flexiplan" system. This is what sold me on Edstrom. The shelves in the flexiplan can be folded up when not in use. I can fit an Optoma 65" DLP in the box (huge) into the leftover space.This makes the Sprinter much more effective as an all around installation and finish rig.

In sum, I spent a ton of time researching before making this sizable investment, and could not be happier. Every time I get into our Ford now, I wish we had the money to replace it with another Sprinter immediately. I will probably get the Mercedes emblem conversion kit for it and make it look the way it was meant to. The last thing I am probably going to do is get ahold of Jay in Chicago for one of those spiffy Jet Racks for the left side above the racks.

This message was edited by eastonaltreee on 06/25/05 21:26 ET.