I've probably brought this up in the past, but trying again since the product is starting to get some traction in the marketplace.

Anyone using Msoft Media Center computers in their installations. Why? Why not?

thanks

You have to ask why not :-)? Let's put it this way. I bought a brand new HP computer with Media Center installled. A completely fresh installation. In other words, no viruses, not unstable or conflicting applications loaded etc. It crashed within minutes of the first time I ran it. As does just about every new out of the box MS PC.

I have experimented with it a bit since. It's not bad and I'm sure if I loaded it on a PC I built and got rid of all the crap that comes pre-loaded on PC's these days it would *hopefully* be half way stable. Except that Microsoft of course will not allow authorized editions of XP with Media Center to be sold because they know Joe Blow will try to load it onto his vintage 1990 laptop and get peeved because it won't be able to run.

Media Center itself is OK. Typical MS software. It's adequate but nothing uniqe, special or thoughtful about it. You'd think a 100 bil company should be able to come up with an interface that could compare to Kaleidascape. You'd think :-)....

I do believe there's a very good chance Media Center or something like it will become a staple in our industry. i.e. a cost effective "media server". Hard drives are way to cheap for companies like K and Audio Request (both products which i like very much BTW) to be able to continue to sell their products for the prices they are for too many more years.

My biggest hesitation (other than Q's obviously accurate stability concerns) is its inability to receive HD in any way but OTA. Would love to see some kind of CableCard provision. Thinking that the computer's abilility to pull program guides like TitanTV, etc. would mitigate the current unidirectional problems with the current CableCard technology.

But am I correct that there's some restriction presently on 3rd party CableCard products?

Otherwise, I again agree w/QQQ's assertion that this (or something similar - where's Apple?) is likely a big part of the future.

Oh, there's another minor (HUGE) limitation I forgot about! It's a "Media Center" without "media"! You can't load DVD's onto it unless you use one of the illegal program that are easy to find on the Net. So it can't be used for the biggest reason you would want one - to store a DVD library! (of course you can do it but the point is it's illegal and requires a workaround). You can load music of course.

QQQ,

Of course you can't... because for Microsoft to overcome the protection would be illegal!!! This doesn't mean the product isn't useful.

The product support WM9 and WM10. Both these formats are very efficient. I wouldn't be surprised is some version of these ends up as the new HD-DVD or Blu-Ray video format. And, if you have the disk space, nothing is stopping you from ripping your whole video collection onto a networked hard drive array.

As far as the product not having any unique features, the user interface is the feature! Being able to use a PC from across the room is what MCE is about.

I'm also surprised to hear you've had so many problems with Media Center Edition out of the box. I'm running a PC with Media Center Edition, and haven't rebooted the PC in over a month now. I'd call that pretty stable! I also find XP to be quite stable. I find applications that cause problems, but they usually are unable to crash windows, although they at times may become unresponsive.

I think that Windows Media Center Edition didn't adequately address the huge amount of storage necessary to make such a solution feasible. But Buffalo Tech has come to the rescue with a 1 TeraByte... YES, I did say TeraByte, RAID 5 network storage array, at a reasonable price.

[Link: buffalotech.com]

This with a Microsoft MCE computer, and for a fraction of the price, this can do more than the proprietary devices aimed at media serving for homes. I'll make a prediction, in slightly more than a year, Microsoft will own this market!

I've consulted with MS on MCE as they wanted an opinion of a custom installer. I made some recommendations but at this time I told them I wouldn't recommend it for installations. Many of the reasons were what QQQ stated. I wouldn't want to get phone calls from customers every time they get a virus or can't get rid of their pop ups.

I can't discuss the details but recommendations were made for software and hardware to provide a more stable platform. Some of your concerns are already being worked on. The ability to load DVDs into your library(legally) might not happen. There are some big copy protection issues. There are some DVD solutions but at the moment they don't seem cost effective. However, downloadable High Def movies that you purchase for your library and are protected from distribution will likely happen.

Media Center as a stand alone product is available now.

Bob

Actually the issue of whether it's illegal to burn a disc to hard drive by a manufacture that obtains a license for DCSS? if adequate copy protection were built in has not been decided in a court of law yet but regardless I think I already indicated you'd have to use an illegal program so I'm not sure why you are telling me the above as if I said otherwise. Ditto for most of the trest of your post.


Huh?


I'd call it typical. In my experience the majority of pre-packaged *consumer* PC systems on the market are unstable. But it all depends on the luck of the draw. Systems sold for business use are tyoucally more stable as the hardware changes less and the manufacturers know they need to be more stable and design them that way.


And I make a prediction that it's going to take a lot longer than that. Microsoft has been trying to take control of the CEDIA market for 10 years now and has barely been a blip on the radar.

BTW, here's a video of Bill Gates *trying* to operate Media Center at CES. Make sure to watch this everyone. Enjoy!

[Link: burzurq.com]

Until I can legaly record my DVD's without resorting to a bootleg add on, and particularly record from Component or other HD from Satellite/Cable it's just a chrome plated gas pedal connected to a Geo.

I could see this being the way we do media in just a few years. They just need to have the right people asking John Q. Customer what they want and then pin down the real problems and solve them.

Tweaks and geeks just don't comprise a profitable mainstream marketshare.

I love it when some PC geek raves up the virtue of wintel machines that can do anything for anyone...

Even the most knowledgeable geek has problems and crashes when dealing with files and new software derived from millions of directions, all with their own way of thinking.

Open platform has no place in systems meant to be custom installed.

If DIY enthusiasts adopt this, or the next thing, that's fine... but i will never sell it OR conect it to what I sell and install, because I will not support it or the daily issues that come with it.

I'm not Micosoft, I can't hire tens of thouands of Indians that speak poor English to take call and read out of a manual to my clients and expoect them to be able to re-boot and find/install new drivers every time they get a new file to play.

Julie, I read an article in your mag about your Mom using a computer... My own parents have long been my reference for creating a user interface and a failsafe mode of operation.

Can you imagine if your Mom (or my parents, or anyone over 30 that doesn't read "Tom's Harware Guide") hired one of us to connect an MCE to a complex keypad and/or remote based distributed a/v system??

This customer will NEVER accept that level of inconsistency... and supporting that system would be very costly for one of us on each end of that sale.

Proprietary systems may not be on the leading edge of every step in the media server category, but they are stable enough that I can sleep at night.

I bet Bill Gates has a Crestron system controlling his media system at home.

You would think that with his money he could afford a hairstylist better than the one that did Jim Carrey's hair on "Dumb and Dumber"...

Got invited to a guy's house for a "business venture" demo of the beast a few weeks ago. The numbers that got thrown around were $1900 cost and ?? thousands of $$ retail.

He had two SD Cable boxes and rabbit ears connected to the MCE and outputted it to the Sears entry level Mitsu 55" and a Blose system. It seemed so clear to him that people would see the bargain in spending literally thousands of $$ on a server and connect it to what I consider bargain dumpster equipment (I mean, it's just a TV - and really, surround sound is just surround sound).

I told him that the cable/sat company had a guizmo that recorded stuff (in HiDef!) for about an extra $15 a month, Pinnacle makes awesome home video software that will let you edit AT YOUR DESK (not on your couch) and the best DVD's nowdays are less than $19 a piece.

I sell the audio system, remote & installation, make my money & run. He'll be married to his servers for ever or until they fire him and pick up a Tivo.

The guy looked at me like I was an idiot.

"I am not a smart man"

- forest gump

Me 'an Fores, we're tight.

He has a HD set, but SD boxes??


He wants to partner up??
With YOU doing the labor and HE will be the technology guy??

Like the Knights said at the bunny cave, Run away...

Microsoft potentialy has the answer in the future i can see X BOX 4 being a product with a stable OS that has big enough hard drives ,media capability Bluray/HD-DVD but it will be in real terms so cheap that it will kill all the low end and some of the mid market for this type of product.It wont compete as just a games console.
Of course it wont be perfect and there will always be a better(in all aspects) way but i am sure they will make it damn hard for others to compete.

Modded X-Boxes at the moment linked and with the right software are stable and offer a lot of what people want with regard to a" Media centre" (Ripped DVD Games Music, photo's etc).
Totally impracticle for the custom installer market but the slow creep towards being seen as a competeing technology will i predict unfortunatly gather pace.