Your boss is required to do it, by law. You can hurt him good if you decide to take him to the labor board.

I'm an employer in Illinois (it's a national law, by the way), and paying time and a half is expensive, but the law is the law. Get your money or go work for a stand-up guy somewhere else.

go to the labor board but also the irs they investigate that stuff your employer owes you alot of money

Thank you tski and theaterworks for your answer. Now I see , how bad my boss is. On my check is 40 hours and extra time up 40 hours is like bonus , so I can not to do anything with that. Tomorow I set up meeting with him. I pull wires , design audio/video , I do install central vac , security , tvs and home theaters , program universal remotes with no help - only help is you guys , so I want to thank you for it . This all I do for $21 before taxes (I use companys van , have 2 weeks paid vacation) ,5 years, every day 10 - 12 hours of work-except sundays , I am not sure about own company (I am not good bussines man) so maybe it is time to switch company. I would like to stay in Hinsdale , Burrridge , Downers Grove IL area.

It does not matter what he calls it, bonus or overtime. If you are paid hourly and he's not paying 1 1/2 for overtime over 40 hours a week, it's ILLEGAL! Without knowing any more about it, I'm thinking that your ability to persuade this guy to begin doing the right thing and cover you for back overtime is about zero. I submit you quit, go work for someone else, and take this guy to the authorities. Did you know that doing so should result in you getting some of your back overtime pay?

Frosts me that I get to compete with someone who derives a lower cost basis for his work illegally.

What Theatreworks says is absolutely true. We are paid bi-weekly and were being paid on a 80 hr work period. Meaning that if i worked 35 hours week 1 and then 45 hours week 2 that would be 80 hours over 2 weeks and no overtime. My boss had called a company meeting one day and started doling out envelopes to everyone explaining that he had found out (on his own) that he is required by federal law that he must pay overtime based on a forty hour work week. This meant that the 35 hour plus 45 hour pay period meant 5 hours overtime pay. Give cudos to my boss for doing this on his own. Also, my state has a law stating that the 80 hour pay period( or a twice monthly) is fine as opposed to the 40 hour week mandated byy federal law. Stae law is void because it cannot overrule THE government.

In San Diego, I believe the pay scale is low and the cost of living is extremely high (We call it the "Sun Tax"). However, entry level installers make about $10.00 and hour (no experience) and some of the more seasoned ones make $35.00 an hour. The $35 an hour guy has to really know his stuff and be efficient with his time. What it all comes down to is that the company has to turn a profit on it's installers.

Here in San Diego, the labor rates vary quite a bit also. Typically, most firms charge around $65.00 an hour for one tech. and about $95.00 an hour for a two-man team, with the second tech being a helper. I have seen rates up to $125.00 per man hour, but I think it is uncommon. I might expect to see those rates in San Francisco, Manhattan, or maybe Boston. If the dealer is charging that much, they should be able to pay quite a bit more.

Piece-work employees can make a lot of money or can starve. Some pre-wire guys around here are making $72K a year for piece work. They really have to bust their hump, however, to make that much. More commonly, they make considerably less. Piece-work guys usually do track homes, where they do a hundred homes all the same. The quality of the installation is usually not good. I notice also, that some of the companies doing track homes don't know very much about audio or video, or aren't concerned about quality. They might put one speaker on extreme right side of the dining room, and the other one on the extreme left side. That's great if you want "half-track" sound, but most people would prefer stereo sound-- hearing both left and right speakers at the same time. They should stick to intercoms.

Unfortunately, Mexico is a few minutes away, which keeps hourly rates somewhat lower around here. Some of those guys will charge $25-20 for their company rate. The quality of the work is usually commensurate with the price, if even. I think they pay their employees about $5.00 to $7.00 an hour. I have to go out and clean up one of their messes every once and a while. Telephone wire is what you use for speakers, right? I've even seen one telephone wire used for four speakers (one pair for each speaker). Sometimes I see car radio speakers screwed into the ceiling with a couple of drywall screws-- maybe even nailed in! A small fraction of installers (or slammers) have a contractor's license or are insured in San Diego. It makes it more difficult for us legitimate guys to compete. On many of the jobs I go on, I am the only person speaking English--all of the other subs are Mexican. Unfortunately, the williness of people comming across the border to work cheap, has affected the labor and billable rates for American-owned companies.

I don't know what it's like in the rest of the country, but I hear both extemes. I would say that on an average, the installer pay is similar to the rates here in S.D, other than the Mexican rates.

You actually have crews coming up to do installs in the states? Wow.

The federal government doesn't legislate a 40 hour work week. That is a state issue that varies by state.

California has a 40 hour week and 8 hour day. Anything over 8 in a day or 40 in a week is OT. A few years back, it was changed to simply a 40 hour week. This gave employers AND employees the flexibility to work more hours one day and less the next depending on workload. A worthwhile example was, an employee could put in extra hours early in the week and leave at noon on Friday. It made sense. But labor is king and the politicians are bought by them, so they switched it back to 8 and 40.

Don't automatically advise him to quit without knowing his situation; family, environment, etc.

YES, tell the boss (respectfully, not trying to slam him) that you understand now the law requires him to pay time and a half for over 40 hours. Give him a chance to make the next move. If he gives you a negative response, THEN it's time to start applying for work elsewhere. But, let him offer the time and a half and start catching up on back OT. Let him know (gently again - it may be a shock, you never know) that you will need to be paid that back overtime and would like to set up a schedule for getting caught up.

If the response is all bad, then the labor board for your state is the next phone call. He will be REQUIRED to catch you up. There is no getting around it.

Let me address the mentality that surfaces in a discussion like this, "You are getting screwed". This was mentioned by a couple previous responses, but I want to hit on it as well.

The wage you make is an agreement between you and the boss. You supply the expertise, he supplies the wage. The two are in even balance, in equilibrium. As long as you work there and both of you continue without making $$$ adjustments, then the balance exists.

If you feel you are underpaid, then you enter into negotiations with him. Come to him with solid reasons (this is my skill set, this is how reliable I am, this is how loyal I am to you, etc) not just "I'm not getting enough." Most bosses know their helpers are their most valuable asset and want to make you happy and successful as well. (That's how I was when I had employees - up to 8 max - not right now). You can work it out. If you are both happy then keep doing it. If not happy, get your resume out there. Relocate if necessary.

You can't say "Your boss is *&#%ing you" unless you want to balance it with the situation of employees who were overpaid and unreliable. Who did what to who in that case? Which of those guys paid the boss back when he didn't get what he expected? These things have a way of balancing themselves out. If you are underpaid and stay, you've made a decision - nobody IS doing anything to you.

Back to the point. The wage you make, as long as you stay, is basically an agreement you have come to with your employer.

This message was edited by Tom Ciaramitaro on 02/11/05 15:22 ET.

Tom, I respectfully disagree.

All this discussion is based on this guy's assertion that his boss is paying him 40 hours of hourly pay and other pay as a "bonus" at the same rate of pay per hour. I don't know this for a fact, but accept the assertion at face value for the sake of discussion until other facts come to light. This, as far as I'm concerned, is discussion only.

Yes, the employee and employer have a verbal or written contract between one another. The contract is governed in part by the laws of the state. (I said federal before, but I'm wrong on that one. In Illinois, where this guy and I are from, overtime is due for over 40 hours of work in a week.)

This guy says his boss is doing this bonus thing. That smacks of a disingenuous skirting of the law. The boss can have the employee agree to anything, verbally or in writing, and that will not change the law one little bit.

Yes, employees can be overpaid, unreliable, or both. Yes, that's a bad deal for the boss, but is not governed by law. Employees can be underpaid, too. As long as they are paid within the framework of the law, there's nothing illegal about that either. Employers are free to fire and employees are free to leave; that's the job marketplace in action.

Let me add that I am a boss, and have been for a couple of decades, so that's where I'm coming from on this. Yes, I have had my share of bad employee experiences, but this is the other side of that coin. Employees rely on their bosses to meet their obligations and make sure the paycheck clears, and it bugs be when those that do the work get stepped on.

This message was edited by Theaterworks on 02/11/05 16:03 ET.

Julie, well said!

Martin