I'm replacing an Pronto 6000 (RF) with a Creston TP next week. Nice idea but you get what you pay for. Let the customer know you tried to hit a certain price point but it's not going to work. Upgrade at your cost if you must to move on to a more profitable project.


Dave

C'mon it's not your fault if the house is too big or built with too much steel and concrete. Cost is a little too extreme .
Sell it to them at retail and throw in the (basic)programming .
There is no reason this job should not be somewhat proffitable if the only issue is range.

A client told us we would put four RF-controlled Sony DSS receivers in his basement. We did so. We got up to twenty feet of RF range, straight up only. The whole rest of the two-story house was dead. Too much oncrete or steel, indeed!

Astonishingly, a friend suggested I solve this by pretending that an unused pair from a CAT-5 was RG-6 and using it to run the signal from far locations to the receivers. Not only did it work, but we used a 3-way splitter to mix three antennas at different places in the house, then amplified the signal 10 db with a cable amp and split it four ways to go into the receivers. Voila! Range where we had none.


It helps to use a signal level meter to "fish" for the remote's output frequency while pushing buttons. The Sonys were around 320 mHz, so a TV amp would not work, but a cable amp would.

Hmmm....that brings up an interesting idea....just use a frequency counter with sufficient range to go up around there if you don't know what the pronto's RF frequency is, then select an antenna with that range or peak performance in that range, or several antennas even. Then do like Ernie did and bring it through existing un-used wires. Might not even have to amp the signal. Sounds like a pretty workable solution. How about some unused telephone conductors?

WOW Ernie sounds interesting,

Funny I think my client and your client are related!

Are you talking about the RF signal or the IR? If you are talking about the RF how do you feed the RF from the transmitter? Not sure I total get it.

THANKS
Pete

Dear Peter,
I hope someone has thought through the fact that the closet that is air conditioned in the summer is heated in the winter...not necessarily the best situation for your equipment...

Peter,
I am talking about the RF signal. The Sony antenna uses an RCA plug, so I connected the phone wire to an RCA jack on a wall plate for the antenna, and to a chassis-mount F connector at the receiver end. And, surprise! the first time I tried it, I just twisted together the three different phone leads. In parallel. Just like it was a phone line!

I would never have done this. My buddy does not know that it should not work, so he did. Lucky him.

I just attached the wires. No baluns, no matching, no nuttin. Just maintained hot and ground, and for all I know even that might not be necessary.

After that it only got as hairy as regular RF stuff -- amplified it, split it out to the four receivers, and used F to RCA adaptors to go into the receivers.

I was a little skeptical about feeding several receivers from a splitter. Back when Sony had that stupid "egg" RF remote, I happened to put the DSS remote's antenna near the antenna for the A/V receiver, and neither remote worked. Seems something in each component leaked something out on the antenna that interfered with the other component. Once the antennas were four feet apart, all was well.

HI all,

Looks as if we have a serious thread going. Just to feild the comment about a the air conditioner, thats not realy a problem Im in South Florida I dont think I have ever turned on my own heater in my life my customer proably won't either.

Ernie I understand what you did, it actualy sounds pretty cool. But unfortunatly I can't apply it to a Pronto Pro. Thanks any ways.

-Pete

Peter sez: Ernie I understand what you did, it actualy sounds pretty cool. But unfortunatly I can't apply it to a Pronto Pro. Thanks any ways.

Peter, I have done lots of Prontos (Prontoes?) but nobody ever popped for the RF version, so I have not had the pleasure and challenge. I guess I am too versatile with IR stuff....

Isn't there some kind of antenna connection into the Pronto Pro receiver? If so, it is vulnerable to creative interception. Please take a minute and let me know how the Pronto Pro receiver picks up the RF signal.

Thanks,

Ernie

Not as of yet .
Tell ya what, why don't ya buy a rfx6000 and experiment Ernie. Take it apart and stick wires in it.

i would try doing what i think kabster was talking about...putting the rf station in a central spot(maybee even 2 or 3 rf stations) in the house and running ir from that spot to the rack(using existing house wires if possible)if you use existing phone wires it will take two pairs, the twist on one pair will kill the ir signal; also try changing the rf code; or go with crestron 1550c robert

Another idea, Peter. If you're still working with this site, put the pronto base in a central location, then try using a wireless IR extender from that location out to the equipment bay. X-10 powermid's are fairly inexpensive, and if finding unused conductors for an Xantech system is out of the question, this might do the trick. They're rated for 100 feet through walls and such. But it sounds like even 50 feet might be all you need.

I too am having RF problems but wiht the Marantz 5200 remote. I was also thinking of opening up the base unit and seeign if it is possible to lengthen the antenna. I dont see why it would be so bad for Marantz or Phillips to add a short stubby antenna to the remote as an option. It would kind of look like a cell phone antenna at the front of the remote kind of like a Nokia! Or do this for the base station. has anybody openend up an RF base yet?

I am sick of the RF issue, I face it almost every day and I happen to have a extender here and I think I will take it apart tonight and we can experiment if all of you will help me here.

Let me just say, that RF issues from Pronto-type and Lexicon remotes, is the sole reason that pushed us towards Crestron.

We are currently in the process of doing our first ST-1700C, and I will tell ya, even with the processor in a metal rack system, using the the "rubber duckey" antenna supplied by Crestron, I get at least 150ft of range with NO dead spots.

Now this is in our showroom, and the rack is not installed in any cabinets yet, but with all the metal, concrete, stone block, and many other pieces of electronic equipment all active in our building, I can go outside and still control the system! How's that for range and reliability?

If I can't do Crestron (and only because of price), I limit the control to one local room, and IR or direct-wiring is the only way the system will be set up. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm tired of servicing systems because of RF issues with control systems, which most of the time, goes un-billable.

Just my 2 cents,


JJP