Screw it, I’m over it all after venting. That and I bought myself a new pistol today. Walked in, walked out with it, no waiting. God Bless America

Our system in Canada is about to go through some changes, trying to ease up the wait times we have to put up with.

From what my mother experienced, I'm not sure how anyone in the US could afford a stay in a hospital without insurance, and for some my guess is insurance costs too much.
My step father had a stroke while in Florida, and about a week later died.
Hospital bill presented to my mother was around $50,000.
Because she was Canadain and would have to actually pay the bill and then try to recoup most of it from her personal insurance up here, they quickly reduced the bill to around $30,000 if she could pay by credit card.

If he had a stroke here at home, she would not have ever seen a bill, except from the funeral parlor for creamation services.
She did say the care that they received was excellent.

I have this theory that is totally unproven, but it seems to apply to medical, to car insurance, basically anything where you are not making payments directly.

When you make a direct payment, as simple as buying a gallon of milk or buying a television, you have determined that it is worth what you are paying for it. There is a limit to how much they can charge you before you will decide that it’s not worth it, and they no longer have a market at that price. The key factor is it is your money, and you don’t spend your money like an idiot.

Enter a middleman, and they are no longer spending their own money. It is likely important for them to keep costs in line, but ultimately it is not their personal funds, so they don’t care as much. At the other end the company supplying the goods or services can jack up the price because they know the person paying the bill doesn’t care.

I once brought our car in to get a dent fixed, and the first question was, are you paying for it, or is insurance paying for it? If we could somehow make sure that we are paying all the bills, then when the hundred dollar Tylenol comes across the wire, you just say forget that. I think it would help keep costs in line.

The problem with "forget that" is that sometimes its a life or death situation. The Tylenol example is one where you could say "forget that" and just have a family member (assuming you are fortunate enough to have family...some people don't) run across to the grocery store and get you a bottle of Tylenol for a few bucks. But in the case of an epipen for someone rushed to the hospital with an allergic reaction...you cant just say "forget that" or your dead.

To be clear here...the Tylenol's $125 line item on your hospital invoice isn't about what Tylenol costs. It's about running a facility where professionals with very expensive degrees are available to diagnose issues and prescribe medication like Tylenol. Think about an HVAC technician handing you a $125 bill for changing a $3 part. You paid for the entire service from the truck roll to diagnostics and the labor and parts to resolve the issue. Again...with the HVAC in most cases you can say "forget that"because you dont have to make fast decisions and no one is likely to die (unless you live in the midwest the last couple weeks).

We are living in the best/wealthiest IMO 1st world nation. One of the reasons for this is that we know when we have to pitch in and pay for things as a group. Our military (for example) is 100% tax payer subsidized. Hasbeen made this statement earlier "The reason our medical system is expensive is because our R&D is subsidizing the rest of the world." How is it that our socialism provided Military is one of if not the best on the planet? Our military R&D is heavily funded by tax dollars. Healthcare R&D would not cease to exist just because we decided to fully fund it with tax dollars.

As a nation we decided that Military is something we need to keep us healthy and happy. As a nation we decided that roads and schools and cops and firemen are something we ALL need to keep us healthy and happy. It's time to add healthcare to that list of must haves.

The only thing that would happen with healthcare if it were subsidized is that finally...once and for all...everyone would have access to healthcare and no one would have to file bankruptcy if they were born with a preexisting condition...or contracted a disease or got hurt. Insurance companies and wall street would have to find some other industry to exploit and erode. Would it be perfect? Of course not. Would it be better than it is now. You better believe it.

The next fight is higher education. Honestly i think we are a few too many decades behind to catch up. As nations like China and India continue to grow it will be harder for the US to just be in control of everything around the globe. We cant go to war with people who have nuclear weapons. I think we need to provide free college to everyone right now if we don't want to end up as someone elses cheap labor force. Maybe even narrow the scope of their education to things like clean energy and reversing the effects of pollution and overpopulation. I think we have enough iOS app developers and English majors.

I broke this out in its own post because its a whole other topic but 100% responsible for the mess we find ourselves in regarding healthcare.

A lot of the cost involved with healthcare right now is going into the pockets of mafia like middlemen... insurance companies and the wallstreeters. They aren't adding anything helpful to the equation. They are simply extracting their cut like a mobster taking his cut from the register of all the stores in his neighborhood.

Their (insurance companies) industry is parasitic by nature and has no place in our society. Wallstreet is basically a craps table at this point...or maybe just a video slot machine in the back of a gas station restaurant.

My insurance (single male 43 non smoker no children) is over $600 a month now yet im still afraid because i know what ambulance rides and copays and medication cost. What kills me the most is exactly why this thread was created today. The wasted time going in to meet with them in person. If you get there late its a big deal. If you get there on time and they see you late its perfectly fine. You get into the office and wait and the doctor comes in and tells you things that could have been said over the phone.

When i went in for my sleep study i got the results, ordered the cpap machine online and i have never been back to the doctor because i know it will be an expensive waste of time.

This situation is not unique to health care. It's a big guy vs little guy thing. The big guy tunes its system to optimize its use of resources. If this is less than optimum for the smaller guy, that's too bad. To some extent it's a "power" thing. Wait on hold is a classic example. The big guy doesn't want to have a second of slack time for the agents, while the caller is trapped in the queue. It's nearly impossible for the caller to manage time while waiting in the queue.

Recently, I had to cancel a health care appointment. Unfortunately, the (completely justified) situation developed outside of their office hours and they did not provide any practical means for me to convey the information in real time. Eventually, hours after the appointment time had passed, they picked up the message, then chastised me for disrupting their schedule by not contacting them.

This burns my bridges. My oldest daughter (8) had a wellness visit/checkup scheduled. It was during the day, so I was at work. My wife caught a 24 hour puke bug the night before. My wife called the doctors office to let them know that her cousin (24) would be bringing her in for the appointment.

The doctor then proceeded to tell my wife that they don't believe a 24 year old is responsible enough to be taking our child to the appointment and tried to reschedule (this would be the 3rd time rescheduling and also a $40 charge for missing the appointment because we didn't call in within 36 hours). Her cousin is listed as our beneficiary in our will and has been in their lives since they were born.

That pediatrician office is no longer seeing our children, which have been going there since birth.

Idiots, the lot of them.

I have been reading about doctors and hospitals who take far less if the patient pays cash or arranges payment outside of insurance and that would put us where we were before insurance shoved their face into the whole situation. The problem comes when a catastrophic illness occurs and specialized equipment & medicines are needed- it's not something many people can afford. Fortunately, endowments and special funds are available at some hospitals- I knew someone who had a heart attack- he needed a triple bypass and a new valve. They kept him in a drug-induced coma for 5 days and without health insurance, it would have cost well over $100K, but it was covered by some kind of fund.

There's nothing easy about solving this and the size of the US population is part of that- I'd really like people to stop telling us that we should be more like Canada, Sweden or other countries when their countries have a fraction of the people we do and after their people have taken better care of themselves. The insurance industry has done a terrible job of implementing preventive care, the FDA has screwed the pooch with their food pyramid and too many people are like fish in a barrel for food commercials.

Does this idiot live under a rock?

Well...? Are you going to leave us hanging, or start a thread about it?

I would have had a hard time with this one. I would have probably told them how stupid they are. Sit outside a pediatricians office and watch who goes in and out. A large percentage of the parents are early 20’s.

On the subject of the $125 Tylenol, it’s also more complicated because of lawsuits. Hospitals and healthcare workers are paranoid about being sued. They won’t let you bring your own drugs in. Some of you know some of the stuff going on with my son. He’s had multiple hospital stays. And every time, my wife takes his prescriptions, but the hospital won’t use those, they have to issue their own drugs from their own pharmacy. And the neurologist that wrote the prescription is the same doctor that treats him in the hospital.

And then there are fools that say "healthcare is a right". Cracks me up. NO, its NOT a right. Period.

It would be great if it was possible to provide all of the care we need, but there's not enough money on Earth for that. Having said that, have you heard/read what Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez wants, in her New Green Deal?

I just read an article where she goes against the lack of rules for Congress and how members are allowed to use their influence to become wealthy.

Someone needs to set up an egg timer, because I really think she won't be around for much longer.

I would have showed them a photo of soldiers storming the beaches of Normandy and asked them to repeat the line about 24 year olds and responsibility.