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What installer would connect two speaker switchers to a Sonos Connect Amp?
This thread has 9 replies. Displaying all posts.
Post 1 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 05:26
PSS
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I came across a Sonos installation when looking at the houses Wifi issues. It has 11 pair of speakers connected via two speaker switchers.........
I asked about the Sonos system and how it sounded, they didn't really have any issues with it. I didn't pursue it anymore and went on to check the WiFi issues.
Damn, I can guarantee if it was done right they'd be able to tell the difference. It's kinda like when you ask "how's the WiFi working?", "It's fine, why?". You can see they have two or three routers, extenders, etc with different names in the house. You pull it all out and out in a decent system and then they say "wow, I didn't know it was supposed to work that quick".
Sometimes you don't know how bad things really are until you try something else.
Post 2 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 07:46
buzz
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There may have been some cost considerations during the initial installation. Now that you have some credibility with them, you could explore the "sounds OK" part.

I never try to tell anyone what sounds "best", I always ask. If the customer is not able to discriminate or doesn't care, I leave things alone. In this case I would open the discussion by asking if they would like to have better control control over the system. (Allowing different music here'n there while saving trips to the speaker control boxes) Initially, pull one pair of speakers off the selector and let them live with that. If there is a sudden revelation that "this room sounds much better than the others", then you can have a more thorough discussion. While it might chaff some of us, many customers simply want background noise and they are fully satisfied with earbud quality.
Post 3 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 08:55
Brad Humphrey
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11 pairs of speakers on a Connect Amp? Across 2 speaker selectors?
What is that like 2-3 watts per speaker after losses. Assuming the Connect Amp isn't burning itself up from improper setup (to low of impedance).

I'm sorry, we can debate all we want about how cheap the customer was. But the installer should have never hooked something like that up. It clearly shows a hack, that has no business in this industry.
At the very least, there should have been a cheap 2ch amp with (1) speaker distribution point.
Post 4 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 09:24
highfigh
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On October 31, 2017 at 08:55, Brad Humphrey said...
11 pairs of speakers on a Connect Amp? Across 2 speaker selectors?
What is that like 2-3 watts per speaker after losses. Assuming the Connect Amp isn't burning itself up from improper setup (to low of impedance).

I'm sorry, we can debate all we want about how cheap the customer was. But the installer should have never hooked something like that up. It clearly shows a hack, that has no business in this industry.
At the very least, there should have been a cheap 2ch amp with (1) speaker distribution point.

For the difference in price between the Connect and Connect Amp, they would be a god way toward buying a Dayton 12 channel amp, but they would still need to control the level of each pair. Piss poor system design, IMO. Even if they used a good 2 channel amp, each speaker is still not getting much power and if they like it loud, the more expensive SSVC pieces is rated for 200W peak, so.....
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 5 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 09:25
highfigh
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On October 31, 2017 at 05:26, PSS said...

Sometimes you don't know how bad things really are until you try something else.

Sounds like "I didn't know he had a drinking problem until I saw him sober".
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 6 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 09:29
3PedalMINI
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Was it a spec home or builder provided system? I’m running into this a bit around here. Toll brothers being some of the worst offenders (the security contractor doing it)
The Bitterness of Poor Quality is Remembered Long after the Sweetness of Price is Forgotten! - Benjamin Franklin
Post 7 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 09:52
jrainey
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On October 31, 2017 at 09:29, 3PedalMINI said...
Was it a spec home or builder provided system? I’m running into this a bit around here. Toll brothers being some of the worst offenders (the security contractor doing it)

That is surprising. What are you running into? We do lots of Toll business down here and in general they spec solutions that actually work. However they do give a lot of latitude to the integrator. We haven't installed a speaker switcher/impedance matcher box in a LONG time
Jack Rainey - Full disclosure...reformed integrator, now mid-Atlantic manufacturers rep for: Integra, Paradigm, Anthem, Parasound, Atlona, LG TV's and Metra Home Theater...among others
Post 8 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 11:50
Richie Rich
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I worked on a job where one Sonos connect amp is running 6 pairs of speakers on one 4 conductor.

Because pool guys are idiots and really shouldn't do anything AV related.
I am a trained professional..... Do not attempt this stunt at home.
Post 9 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 14:37
Ernie Gilman
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On October 31, 2017 at 07:46, buzz said...

While it might chaff some of us, many customers simply want background noise and they are fully satisfied with earbud quality.

Especially if they were brought up using only portable devices.

A guy who only came on when PBS wanted to suck bucks from the listeners told a story. The theme was love and how to do it.

He was in Thailand taking a tour of a topiary garden. At one place, he wasn't sure what the trees were supposed to look like. The tour guide said "this is a gloop of gleen labbits."

Wha?

Turned out it was a group of green rabbits. Here's where the lesson comes in: Apparently the language the man was speaking had no R sound. Because he had never learned to make an R sound, when he heard an R it sounded like an L to him.* So when the guy said, "oh, a group of green rabbits," the tour guide said "yes, a gloop of gleen labbits."

If the client is not schooled in how things are supposed to sound, and does not know how wonderful an audio system can sound, he not only won't recognize that he has a crappy sounding system, when he hears a great system he might need details pointed out to him! He's okay listening to a lock gloop when there's a GREAT rock group on that CD!





*Linguistic reasons can be given if you want 'em.
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 10 made on Tuesday October 31, 2017 at 18:20
buzz
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On October 31, 2017 at 08:55, Brad Humphrey said...
Assuming the Connect Amp isn't burning itself up from improper setup (to low of impedance).

While CONNECT:AMP is not everyone's idea of a great sounding amplifier, they are hearty and won't tolerate any speaker load abuse. If the amp is upset, it will back off the volume or shut down. There is adequate over current and temperature protection. Overall, I think that they are one of the most bombproof amplifiers on the market. While one can overload the Line-In, the power amplifier will not operate into clipping. This characteristic also minimizes the risk of speaker damage.

Note that I'm not trying to justify the original design, I'm only pointing out a fortunate characteristic of the amplifier.

Another lucky break for the original designer is that the CONNECT:AMP will not likely drive the speaker control boxes into saturation. While it's tempting to throw a large amplifier at this project, the big amp will saturate the control boxes and cause trouble.

---

PSS, if you have a demo CONNECT:AMP, pull one room off of the control box abomination under the pretext of giving the customer better control in that room with the spare CONNECT:AMP. After a few days ask how the customer enjoys the control and if the room sounds OK. At this point you'll now if better control and better sound is important to the customer. Note that it is important to factory reset any Sonos unit before moving it from one system to another. -- Otherwise there will be a mess of mingled music libraries and online services. (Been there, done that, it was ugly.)


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