I see copper used all the time. Its the most commonly used pipe in my experience.

I think copper or not depends on the area and the contractor.  I rarely see copper in "flips" or tracts. Partly, I think that this is for cost, and partly for security. If the flip is in a not so great neighborhood, there is a significant risk of copper thieves visiting the site at night.

I haven’t seen copper used for water in years! PEX is all I see. It is superior in almost every regard.

Yeah, I haven’t seen copper in years either. Just visited a “castle” that has some of the most spectacular pipe work I have ever seen in person. By pipe I mean pet.

This whole discussion would have been easier if things had been called by their accurate names.

Pet pipe...cleaner

Thanks for the responses. Sure, I shouldn't have said water conduit...it just slipped out, maybe because they were using white schedule 40 pvc that, by it's labeling, is meant to be used for water. I'm no plumber.

I believe this is what they ran under ground. It's like Lowe's was out of the conduit they needed (we buy them out of stock on a regular basis) and so they settled for this:

[Link: lowes.com]

If you who asked about the turns, not using sweeps...if this is what you were thinking maybe they used:

[Link: lowes.com]

I haven't seen any evidence of that. Looks like they're using these, like they should:

[Link: lowes.com]


Also, honestly I don't know if they fiber is outdoor rated. I know it isn't direct burial for sure. I'll have to find that out...and if it isn't, bring it up with the boss man. I've learned a decent bit from the folks here about the details of wire/cable/etc. I know that if it isn't outdoor rated, it should be, because it just won't hold up over time. Boss man (owner) is a very smart guy, but it was only a few years ago that we got into (before I started with the company) doing these commercial projects. That's a detail that could have been missed. Before that it was all residential stuff.

One last thing, someone mentioned not using the same sub-contractors again. Frankly I've got no problem with that. The fact that they hadn't used a drop of pvc glue until I mentioned it to hire ups (it appears that they're using some sort of clear pvc glue now) is 100% unacceptable to me. Today, though, and another large project we're starting...they were there, doing stuff for us. It's all indoor. I'm glad that WE don't have to do it - in all honesty, we couldn't, we have so many projects lined up that we have to sub out a lot of work - but still, what I've seen makes me wary of their work. I may or may not make a case against using them in the future to boss man. Again, thanks for the responses!

So, rigid pvc...you're saying that the water pipe (sch 40) should be just fine?

The biggest problem in what they have done is the short 90s BY FAR.

Schedule40 water and electrical is the same except for color and electrical has some UV resistant properties. I am not sure about the code implications, but as far as whether i would loose sleep or not, the answer is no. I would not personally be bothered by white pvc in the ground. I would however be VERY bothered by the 90s. You will never pull anything through there again!!!

The rough spec I was given when pulling my first fiber was not to bend it to a radius smaller than a softball. If you have actually pulled a length of fiber through water 90s, not sweeps, you have damaged it at least every five or six inches!

They haven't done that. I wouldn't even need to ask a question about that...i'd implore, beg my boss to fire them.

They DID do something bad with some water pipe today, though...to the tune of up to 100 grand maybe?

Your second statement makes me think those guys are in a category where you'd BETTER ask the question you "wouldn't even need to."

As someone else here says, you can't fix stupid. Let's also note that stupid is rarely concentrated in one subject. It usually filters through into everything.

The fiber should be burial rated. Water WILL fill that buried pipe at some point. The typical installation bend radius for a 6 strand distribution type fiber is 3 to 3.5", assuming a 1" pipe was used along with those 90's you are definitely not at a 3" bend radius. That being said, todays fiber is fairly forgiving during installation, the bigger issue in my mind is that once installed the tight bends create attenuation points in the fiber and that may create issues. We sell and spec a lot of fiber and I have seen things that I was was told would never work, in service and functioning perfectly with tests to prove it.

Attenuation issues aside, one could minimize the damage potential if the pipe/fiber is "assembled", rather than "pulled". By this I mean that that the fiber is inserted as each section of pipe is assembled, rather than as one long pull after the pipe is installed. All of those sharp 90° bends will, however, impede replacement of the fiber if this becomes necessary in the future.

This seems to be worse than pulling. Let's say you have a hundred feet of fiber to assemble into five twenty foot sections of pipe; let's say it's all a straight run, just to make it simpler.

If you're not going to pull the fiber through the pipes, then you're going to hold down one end of the fiber and unroll the entire hundred feet out onto the ground. Then you take the pipes, one at a time, and go to the end of the fiber piece, put the pipe around the fiber, and walk the pipe over to the starting point. Do this with the next piece and glue the pipes together (without getting any glue on the fiber).

If the pipes are to be installed 18" below grade, they will have to be placed there NOW in this process.

You'll continue this until they are all assembled, with no glue getting on the jacket of the fiber anywhere.

If it's not a straight line, and, let's say you have to sweep around two corners, you then have the three-dimensional problem of being able to reach down 18" below grade to glue the pipes together, while maintaining them going around the corner at the same depth.

This sounds like an designer's idea, where the real steps of actually doing it right have not been envisioned.


Can we please have confirmation that NO 90s were used for fiber except for large-radius sweeps? I think a water 90 and a sweep 90 has been shown, but it has not been made clear whether water 90s were ever used.


Also, when you hear "three-inch radius," does your mind instantly envision something a bit smaller than a volleyball (8.15 inches in diameter) or about the size of a softball (3.5 or 3.8 inches in diameter)?

The right answer is that you should envision a bit smaller than a volleyball, but I ask this because no matter what, when I hear "radius," the picture that comes to mind is almost always "diameter."