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Topic:
Pray for Dallas
This thread has 101 replies. Displaying posts 31 through 45.
Post 31 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 10:23
highfigh
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On July 9, 2016 at 23:43, Trunk-Slammer -Supreme said...
Stan,

Here's a few more facts that you should take into account before telling people to GFYourself.

[Link: theconservativetreehouse.com]

As I said before, the biggest part of the problem is that so many just cannot wait until ALL the facts are in. See a little misinformation and jump to a conclusion, is not the way to go. At that point you become part of the problem.

Oh, no! That link has 'conservative' in it- he'll never believe anything in it?

He didn't have a CCP, either.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 32 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 10:27
Audible Solutions
Super Member
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Yes, if it has a Conservative origin the odds are it will be disinformation--as with the shameful attempt by Conservative disinformation sites to sully the name of murdered man in Minnesota. Till Conservatives deal with their own internal contradictions--2nd Amendment is for all citizens, not only white, wrongful shootings should call for the same outrage that the OP presented for the deaths of DART officers. But we'll never get that because Conservatives will never accept facts, fairness or reason:
"According to various studies, not just one, but a wide range of studies that have been carried out over a number of years, African Americans are 30 percent more likely than whites to be pulled over.
After being pulled over, African Americans and Hispanics are three times more likely to be searched.
Last year African Americans were shot by police at more than twice the rate of whites.
African Americans are arrested at twice the rate of whites; African Americans defendants are 75 percent more likely to be charged with offenses carrying mandatory minimums. They receive sentences that are almost ten percent longer than comparable whites arrested for the same crime.
So that if you add it all up, the African American and Hispanic population, who make up only 30 percent of the general population, make up more than half of the incarcerated population."--Barack Oabama
"This is a Christian Country,Charlie,founded on Christian values...when you can't put a nativiy scene in front fire house at Christmas time in Nacogdoches Township, something's gone terribly wrong"
Post 33 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 10:57
Audible Solutions
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If I offer you a thought piece from a Conservative web site will you take it in? I didn't think so, and that, summarizes the pathetic state of this nation better than anything else. There is a sad lack of empathy among Conservatives and a hypocrisy that a man in Minnesota was murdered for exercising his 2nd Amendment rights--and you are all silent. I don't support the 2nd Amendment as do you but I am consistent and you are all not.

[Link: redstate.com]
"This is a Christian Country,Charlie,founded on Christian values...when you can't put a nativiy scene in front fire house at Christmas time in Nacogdoches Township, something's gone terribly wrong"
Post 34 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 11:34
highfigh
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On July 10, 2016 at 10:27, Audible Solutions said...
Yes, if it has a Conservative origin the odds are it will be disinformation--as with the shameful attempt by Conservative disinformation sites to sully the name of murdered man in Minnesota. Till Conservatives deal with their own internal contradictions--2nd Amendment is for all citizens, not only white, wrongful shootings should call for the same outrage that the OP presented for the deaths of DART officers. But we'll never get that because Conservatives will never accept facts, fairness or reason:
"According to various studies, not just one, but a wide range of studies that have been carried out over a number of years, African Americans are 30 percent more likely than whites to be pulled over.
After being pulled over, African Americans and Hispanics are three times more likely to be searched.
Last year African Americans were shot by police at more than twice the rate of whites.
African Americans are arrested at twice the rate of whites; African Americans defendants are 75 percent more likely to be charged with offenses carrying mandatory minimums. They receive sentences that are almost ten percent longer than comparable whites arrested for the same crime.
So that if you add it all up, the African American and Hispanic population, who make up only 30 percent of the general population, make up more than half of the incarcerated population."--Barack Oabama

And the Liberal media are the last bastion of honesty? Give it a rest!

Who's committing the crimes? Look there for the reason more of any group is in prison.

Chris Rock did a bit about how to not get your ass kicked by the cops. It's really simple. Don't fight with the police, don't make sudden movements, don't mouth off, don't run, don't try to drive over them, don't carjack, don't rob people and shoot people over petty beefs. Obey the effing laws!

IMO, Whites who commit the same crimes deserve the same sentence. Now, tell me that came from a Liberal.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 35 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 11:42
Fins
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11,627
When I saw the cellphone video of the Louisiana shooting on CNN, my immediate reaction was holy shit those bastards murdered him. I couldn't believe they would pin a man to the ground and shoot him twice in the back of the head because he pinned his hand under his chest to refuse being handcuffed.

Then a day or two later, I was in my favorite gun shop and talking about it with a retired law enforcement officer. He hadn't seen the video. So I googled it and found the link. But it was a different video. A better angle, clear, higher definition video. In this video I could see the man was on his back, with his hand back under his body. In the area it turned out he had a gun stashed. Did the cops know he had a gun and was reaching for it? No, but they had reports he had been brandishing a handgun earlier.


.

Last edited by Fins on July 10, 2016 12:58.
Civil War reenactment is LARPing for people with no imagination.

Post 36 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 11:50
highfigh
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On July 10, 2016 at 10:57, Audible Solutions said...
If I offer you a thought piece from a Conservative web site will you take it in? I didn't think so, and that, summarizes the pathetic state of this nation better than anything else. There is a sad lack of empathy among Conservatives and a hypocrisy that a man in Minnesota was murdered for exercising his 2nd Amendment rights--and you are all silent. I don't support the 2nd Amendment as do you but I am consistent and you are all not.

[Link: redstate.com]

You think being consistent makes you better? What it you're consistently wrong?

Have you ever thought, just once, what a cop has to deal with? They're badly outnumbered and in the Black "community", nobody wants to talk when a crime is committed. People who are shot don't cooperate because they want to handle it for themselves. They sometimes don't want to talk, even when little kids are shot- WTF kind of "community" is that?

Re: the 2nd Amendment- we have the right to possess guns, but there's no right to use them to commit a crime or use them irresponsibly. "Good guy with a gun" can work, but in order for that to happen, it can't be in a gun free zone or with many people in the area.

As the article shows- "The truth, as always, lies somewhere in the middle, but acknowledging that requires looking in the mirror in a way that makes us all a little uncomfortable.". Any time more than one opinion exists, the truth is that little sliver of information in the middle.

Yeah, I read it. What was your point?
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 37 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 11:50
Impaqt
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2 1/2 pages of relatively calm discussion and then Bruce needs to get his 3 cents in starting off with blatant personal attacks.

If you cant discuss, please stay out of the discussion.

Thank you to everyone else for keeping the conversations this past week on point and civil.

Carry on.
Post 38 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 12:04
Audible Solutions
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On July 10, 2016 at 11:34, highfigh said...
And the Liberal media are the last bastion of honesty? Give it a rest!

Who's committing the crimes? Look there for the reason more of any group is in prison.

Chris Rock did a bit about how to not get your ass kicked by the cops. It's really simple. Don't fight with the police, don't make sudden movements, don't mouth off, don't run, don't try to drive over them, don't carjack, don't rob people and shoot people over petty beefs. Obey the effing laws!

IMO, Whites who commit the same crimes deserve the same sentence. Now, tell me that came from a Liberal.

Shall we call bullshit? The facts show you are wrong. Not my facts, but facts because facts, do not know ideology or politics. It's why you shock me being in an industry that relies on facts--physics, math, empirical measurement--when you are clearly inured to them. I posted the facts above. Blacks are 30% more likely to be pulled over on a traffic stop. After being pulled over, Blacks and Latinos are 3 times likely to be searched than whites. Blacks are twice as likely to be shot by police. Blacks are arrested 2x the rate of whites; 75% more likely to be arrested for offenses carrying mandatory minimums and receive sentences for the same crimes that are 10% longer.

You want to speak to ideology and ignore the facts because you wish to remain ignorant, intolerant and, shall we say it, prejudiced. I already linked to a Conservative writer on this story. "These excuses, though, are indicative of an abdication of critical thinking about the legal and proper application of police force that really and truly is endemic in America" Leon Wolf. The link can be found above

Conservatives speak to small government. They speak about the need to hold weapons to confront tyranny. The demand the right to carry those weapons. I guess you ought to admit that it's only for white, Christians since no others can be properly defined as American and so allowed their rights under the constitution.
"This is a Christian Country,Charlie,founded on Christian values...when you can't put a nativiy scene in front fire house at Christmas time in Nacogdoches Township, something's gone terribly wrong"
Post 39 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 12:21
Trunk-Slammer -Supreme
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7,454
Alan, quoting Obama is not "the facts".


All he is doing is repeating statistics from some study, and statistics are rarely on the mark, but are skewed to reach a certain point.


Bottom line on these killings (notice I did not say murders, as murder is something planned), is that we don't know the truth because we weren't there. Secondhand stories seem to always have a lot of misinformation, so it's best not to assume any of it it true.

But, then again, we can all just run out and block a highway. That'll make it all better....
Post 40 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 12:31
Audible Solutions
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On July 10, 2016 at 11:50, highfigh said...
You think being consistent makes you better? What it you're consistently wrong?

Have you ever thought, just once, what a cop has to deal with? They're badly outnumbered and in the Black "community", nobody wants to talk when a crime is committed. People who are shot don't cooperate because they want to handle it for themselves. They sometimes don't want to talk, even when little kids are shot- WTF kind of "community" is that?

Re: the 2nd Amendment- we have the right to possess guns, but there's no right to use them to commit a crime or use them irresponsibly. "Good guy with a gun" can work, but in order for that to happen, it can't be in a gun free zone or with many people in the area.

As the article shows- "The truth, as always, lies somewhere in the middle, but acknowledging that requires looking in the mirror in a way that makes us all a little uncomfortable.". Any time more than one opinion exists, the truth is that little sliver of information in the middle.

Yeah, I read it. What was your point?

Final comment, since you are clearly beyond rational talk. You are seeking out excuses for behaviors that cannot be excused. Did you read any of the links I posted? I thought not. You bring up useless information on the 2nd Amendment--as the individual in Minnesota told the police officer--because we have contemporaneous testimony that the officer was told he had a weapon, a permit to carry and his wallet was in his pocket. You don't care.

The truth is only in the middle because you are resistant to facts. You're not alone but it is the case. I quoted Newt Gingrich on the subject. I'm betting you did not read it. Do you read? I am betting you do not. You seek out those who confirm what you think true and that reinforces what you think. So you believe cables effect the sound of music? I did not give you opinions. I gave you facts. I suggested you look at the videos. What is also interesting in Wolf's article is after presenting his case he offers this insight:
"The most important safety valve to prevent violence like we saw in Dallas last night is the belief that when officers do go off the rails, the legal system will punish them accordingly."

Continue to use the distortion to deflect from truth. Continue to use the same sad memes to ignore reality. It's the media. It's the liberals. It's trouble makers. It's whomever you wish to use as the scapegoat of the day: Muslims, Jews, Liberals, Hispanics, Blacks, others. There is a problem. You wish to define it out of the conversation. The OP worried about police. He's right. But he overlooks, as you will not consider, that the basic unfairness with which law is enforced will lead to more violence because it suggests that some parts of society are not included in society.

It's not just about the facts. It's about the resistance to fact by those of us in an industry based upon facts. Or are you one of those who use any wire, of any gage and type and then connect and pray? There are not your facts or my facts. There are facts.

With this I am through.
"This is a Christian Country,Charlie,founded on Christian values...when you can't put a nativiy scene in front fire house at Christmas time in Nacogdoches Township, something's gone terribly wrong"
Post 41 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 12:34
The Lizardking Part II
Long Time Member
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First off hello all, it's been awhile, I have knee deep in family health issues, and many other distractions, spinning about a half-dozen plates at once. I checked in after search for a link for an automated mount for a client, I started reading threads and this was the second one a read and just about lost my mind....From what I know about those who post most if not all have not worked in a Law Enforcement capacity and have never been in a life and death fight, please if I am wrong correct me. I can’t tell if Mac is just busting balls, but Stanley you are waaay off base here, and your willful ignorance is breathtaking?

In the first incident in Louisiana, I have seen all available video, and while it is tragic that a man had to die, all he had to do is comply with the officers, if you think it’s unjustified or not you are NOT entitled to resist a lawful order. They were not out bored one night looking to kill a black man, quite the opposite more white men are killed by police than blacks, that’s the DOJ/ FBI stats not mine. The Officers were there for a call of a man with a gun, menacing people, he was asked to comply, and he didn’t. One of the officers was trying to control his hand that was in the pocket with the gun, that was the officer that was on top of him, again IF he complies he may well still be alive, but he chooses to continue to fight and this is after being tazed and having no effect. Should they have waited until he shot one of them first? Is that the new standard?

Now the second incident in Minnesota, the woman “live streaming” her boyfriend being shot while going for his permit, turns out he is NOT a permit holder, they checked with the county Sherriff who issues them and since he is a criminal he was NEVER issued one, NEVER applied for one, and would had NEVER been issued one. Now I have seen the video from the store he allegedly robbed and it’s a pretty close match, but his gun was in his lap not in a holster, an inconvenient fact that the girlfriend accidently caught as she was spewing her bullshite. So he is not an innocent angel as she alleges, in fact he was a possible armed robbery suspect in a car that matches the description by the guy that matches the description and when the Officer approaches he sees a gun in the suspected robber lap, yells for him not to go for the gun, does and gets shot, on what planet was he wrong?

My professional opinion, and mine is from someone who has been there and done that, I am retired Police Officer and I HAVE been in these situations and unless you have or unless you were there at the time of the incident you are nothing more than a UNINFORMED Monday morning quarterback.

Incident #1 – They did not control the scene or the suspect, after the tazer was ineffective, in a perfect world they would have stepped back and waited for more officers, but remember they were there for a man menacing folks with a gun and the suspect won’t take his hand out of his pocket, and my GUESS is that they thought they could control him but were wrong, and when the officer got on top of him he felt the gun and was trying to control the hand with the gun and the suspect was able to get his hand either loose or at least on the weapon to where he felt he was going to fire, and you CAN fire a gun through your pants, by the way..From a tactical perspective I question shooting that close to my partner, but he was there I was not and he did what he felt he had to do to live, despite what Stanley wants.

Incident #2 – Does it strike anyone else how calm she was when he got shot with the kid in the back seat? Again my guess from EXPERIENCE, as he approached the car matching the description of a car used ARMED ROBBERY, he also noticed the SUSPECT in the ARMED ROBBERY, was in the car and as he got to the window he noticed a GUN sitting in his lap, tells him not to move, he does, and 5 seconds later she has her camera on to record him doing what? The officer is yelling “why did you do that?” and her all calm and composed for the camera, his emotion was the correct response to the situation her lack of is fake, she immediately was trying to figure out a way to flip this, to garner sympathy and the press is only too eager to please..

Unless you have been in the position of having to defend yourself in a life and death situation where nano-seconds count please do us all a favor and shut the c&$kholster in the lower center of your face. You have NO IDEA what it is like to walk up to a car that you have pulled over knowing full well that the person inside may in fact pulled an armed robbery and be waiting for you to get just close enough to shoot, or it could just be a family out for a nice afternoon ride for ice cream and if your wrong, your life, your career is over, all of this goes thru your mind in the short walk to the car door…..

And you have the balls to tell me you know better, you can go f$&k yourself, I have been there and I have done that and have the scars and shrapnel to prove it, and I have been to too many funerals and more to come, I’m sure. And luckily for you they do it for each other, their families, and your ungrateful ass, and that’s why I retired, because I lost the will to defend the ungrateful and that’s not fair to the guys that are willing to do it, for they are truly better men than me.
Seth Goyne
OP | Post 42 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 14:02
radiorhea
Super Member
Joined:
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3,264
On July 10, 2016 at 11:50, Impaqt said...
2 1/2 pages of relatively calm discussion and then Bruce needs to get his 3 cents in starting off with blatant personal attacks.

If you cant discuss, please stay out of the discussion.

Thank you to everyone else for keeping the conversations this past week on point and civil.

Carry on.

Thanks Impact, best moderating I have seen yet!!

Unlike Stan, the rest have kept it civil, we CAN have this discussion and need to have this discussion, or there will be an all out war. Just what our president wants, so he can call for Marshall Law, and take over the country.

If you do not think that is what he is up to, try reading his speeches, and understand the stradegy. Divide and Conquer. Never let a good tradegy go to waste. I can go on and on...

He promised to FUNDEMENTALLY CHANGE THIS COUNTRY.

Hillary will continue the same agenda....sad for this place.

Last edited by radiorhea on July 10, 2016 14:12.
Drinking upstream from the herd since 1960
OP | Post 43 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 14:12
radiorhea
Super Member
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3,264
On July 10, 2016 at 12:34, The Lizardking Part II said...
First off hello all, it's been awhile, I have knee deep in family health issues, and many other distractions, spinning about a half-dozen plates at once. I checked in after search for a link for an automated mount for a client, I started reading threads and this was the second one a read and just about lost my mind....From what I know about those who post most if not all have not worked in a Law Enforcement capacity and have never been in a life and death fight, please if I am wrong correct me. I can’t tell if Mac is just busting balls, but Stanley you are waaay off base here, and your willful ignorance is breathtaking?

In the first incident in Louisiana, I have seen all available video, and while it is tragic that a man had to die, all he had to do is comply with the officers, if you think it’s unjustified or not you are NOT entitled to resist a lawful order. They were not out bored one night looking to kill a black man, quite the opposite more white men are killed by police than blacks, that’s the DOJ/ FBI stats not mine. The Officers were there for a call of a man with a gun, menacing people, he was asked to comply, and he didn’t. One of the officers was trying to control his hand that was in the pocket with the gun, that was the officer that was on top of him, again IF he complies he may well still be alive, but he chooses to continue to fight and this is after being tazed and having no effect. Should they have waited until he shot one of them first? Is that the new standard?

Now the second incident in Minnesota, the woman “live streaming” her boyfriend being shot while going for his permit, turns out he is NOT a permit holder, they checked with the county Sherriff who issues them and since he is a criminal he was NEVER issued one, NEVER applied for one, and would had NEVER been issued one. Now I have seen the video from the store he allegedly robbed and it’s a pretty close match, but his gun was in his lap not in a holster, an inconvenient fact that the girlfriend accidently caught as she was spewing her bullshite. So he is not an innocent angel as she alleges, in fact he was a possible armed robbery suspect in a car that matches the description by the guy that matches the description and when the Officer approaches he sees a gun in the suspected robber lap, yells for him not to go for the gun, does and gets shot, on what planet was he wrong?

My professional opinion, and mine is from someone who has been there and done that, I am retired Police Officer and I HAVE been in these situations and unless you have or unless you were there at the time of the incident you are nothing more than a UNINFORMED Monday morning quarterback.

Incident #1 – They did not control the scene or the suspect, after the tazer was ineffective, in a perfect world they would have stepped back and waited for more officers, but remember they were there for a man menacing folks with a gun and the suspect won’t take his hand out of his pocket, and my GUESS is that they thought they could control him but were wrong, and when the officer got on top of him he felt the gun and was trying to control the hand with the gun and the suspect was able to get his hand either loose or at least on the weapon to where he felt he was going to fire, and you CAN fire a gun through your pants, by the way..From a tactical perspective I question shooting that close to my partner, but he was there I was not and he did what he felt he had to do to live, despite what Stanley wants.

Incident #2 – Does it strike anyone else how calm she was when he got shot with the kid in the back seat? Again my guess from EXPERIENCE, as he approached the car matching the description of a car used ARMED ROBBERY, he also noticed the SUSPECT in the ARMED ROBBERY, was in the car and as he got to the window he noticed a GUN sitting in his lap, tells him not to move, he does, and 5 seconds later she has her camera on to record him doing what? The officer is yelling “why did you do that?” and her all calm and composed for the camera, his emotion was the correct response to the situation her lack of is fake, she immediately was trying to figure out a way to flip this, to garner sympathy and the press is only too eager to please..

Unless you have been in the position of having to defend yourself in a life and death situation where nano-seconds count please do us all a favor and shut the c&$kholster in the lower center of your face. You have NO IDEA what it is like to walk up to a car that you have pulled over knowing full well that the person inside may in fact pulled an armed robbery and be waiting for you to get just close enough to shoot, or it could just be a family out for a nice afternoon ride for ice cream and if your wrong, your life, your career is over, all of this goes thru your mind in the short walk to the car door…..

And you have the balls to tell me you know better, you can go f$&k yourself, I have been there and I have done that and have the scars and shrapnel to prove it, and I have been to too many funerals and more to come, I’m sure. And luckily for you they do it for each other, their families, and your ungrateful ass, and that’s why I retired, because I lost the will to defend the ungrateful and that’s not fair to the guys that are willing to do it, for they are truly better men than me.

Well said.
Drinking upstream from the herd since 1960
Post 44 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 15:22
Bonavox
Select Member
Joined:
Posts:
May 2008
2,349
Jeronimo Yanez the police officer who shot Philando Castile is Hispanic, but I'm assuming he must be racist too?

Right Alan?
Bill's Electric & Home Theater & Plumbing & Automation & Small Engine Repair, and Animal Removal Services......did I mention we do remotes also?
Post 45 made on Sunday July 10, 2016 at 15:46
designed
Long Time Member
Joined:
Posts:
November 2012
296
On July 10, 2016 at 15:22, Bonavox said...
Jeronimo Yanez the police officer who shot Philando Castile is Hispanic, but I'm assuming he must be racist too?

Right Alan?

No he will be another George Zimmerman in the eyes of the media.
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