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Topic:
Universal Remote with I-pad
This thread has 15 replies. Displaying all posts.
Post 1 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 08:50
brianhifi
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My question would be , what is the best wholesale idea for programming , of course purchasing a Register Key , I usually use URC .
But Harmony / Logictech has a product out , called the Ultimate Home Control
all in one box , with a flasher wi-fi hub , they give you an Ok Remote , black or white ,plus a register key , to program one - I-Pad , & an I-phone or several phones . We have installed most of it , just not the I-pad yet . How different are the graphics , compared to URC . It appears to be a great deal , for clients , of course there's no profit , in the Harmony stuff , Best Buy ,etc .
But there is money in all the programming . Also I know RTI has a unit & Pro Control . Does anyone understand this question . Appreciate any advice at all , folks ,
Kind Regards
Brian
brian k boris
Post 2 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 09:37
cma
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The Harmony remotes suck.. Any $$ you make in install and programming will be lost in your first service call... which will be guaranteed to happen.
Post 3 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 11:35
buzz
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brianhifi,

I'm not a fan of Harmony. Cost aside, I can't get the results that I want.

I've been using TouchControl. Hardware costs are minimal, zero if all of your devices offer IP control. Screen layout and user interactions are limited by your imagination. You'll go through a learning curve because this is a different development environment from Harmony, RTI, ProControl and URC, but once you get used to it, you can rapidly layout screens. Graphics are whatever you want. Every button could be a remote web page if you like, but this sort of scheme would require too much processor power. Unlike ProControl, RTI, and URC, there is no central "processor". If your application requires storing lots of "states" and performing operations when the controller (iPad/iPhone) is sleeping, then TouchControl is not directly applicable -- however, if you throw something like a Raspberry Pi into the mix as a processor (you are on your own for this), the sky is the limit.

Multi-room is very easy. Virtually all of my systems are multi-room and any controller can control any room. If a cable channel or its icon changes, I only need to make one central change and all of the rooms incorporate this change. I don't think that this is a great idea, but one controller can directly interact with another controller and controllers can interact with data in the "Cloud".

While not required for basic programs, you'll achieve the best results if you are comfortable with JavaScript.

Last edited by buzz on October 10, 2015 12:50.
Post 4 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 12:29
ichbinbose
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On October 10, 2015 at 09:37, cma said...
The Harmony remotes suck.. Any $$ you make in install and programming will be lost in your first service call... which will be guaranteed to happen.

+1
Post 5 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 15:45
Lowhz
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Go for the Harmony. As a distributor and rep I have a TON of CI customers that buy them all the time.
Post 6 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 15:48
Ernie Gilman
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If there were a new Yugo on the market, would you be hot to go give it a test drive?
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 7 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 18:31
goldenzrule
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On October 10, 2015 at 15:45, Lowhz said...
Go for the Harmony. As a distributor and rep I have a TON of CI customers that buy them all the time.

That doesn't mean anything. Just means you have a bunch of CI's as customers that either do not know how to program a much better control system, or you have trunk slammer customers. I see lots of CI's at ADI buying old remotes like the MX850 and I just shake my head. IT's 2015.
Post 8 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 20:01
buzz
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Earlier this week I bumped into an older Harmony at a customer's house. In my opinion, this was worse than attempting to use a pile of remotes, but it did fit in a nice little box on the coffee table. At least the pile of remotes would not present endless help screens (that did not help one bit). I have no idea who programmed this. We were doing some emergency upgrades for a wedding that hopefully went well today. It was not the right time to suggest a remote upgrade.

I'm not much of an MX850 fan, but I can use them as a foot in the door. Someone in my area cranked out a ton of these, pretty much using the default configurations and I'm sure that only a few minutes of programming effort was expended. The systems are not much fun to use. We'll be called in to replace a TV or add something and I'll need to modify the program. With a little bit of rearrangement of the programming I can provide a much better user experience and capture a customer for life.
Post 9 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 21:25
Lowhz
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On October 10, 2015 at 18:31, goldenzrule said...
That doesn't mean anything. Just means you have a bunch of CI's as customers that either do not know how to program a much better control system, or you have trunk slammer customers. I see lots of CI's at ADI buying old remotes like the MX850 and I just shake my head. IT's 2015.

No, it means a bunch of CIs use Harmony. They get in, get out and get paid. Next job.
Post 10 made on Saturday October 10, 2015 at 23:59
Mac Burks (39)
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On October 10, 2015 at 08:50, brianhifi said...
My question would be , what is the best wholesale idea for programming , of course purchasing a Register Key , I usually use URC .

I really don't understand this question/s? What is a register key?

But Harmony / Logictech has a product out , called the Ultimate Home Control
all in one box , with a flasher wi-fi hub , they give you an Ok Remote , black or white ,plus a register key , to program one - I-Pad , & an I-phone or several phones . We have installed most of it , just not the I-pad yet .

Harmony Ultimate is great. I haven't used the iPad app or the iPhone but i did load the iPhone version on my own phone to test it out. Graphics are good. You can't customize anything.

How different are the graphics , compared to URC . It appears to be a great deal , for clients , of course there's no profit , in the Harmony stuff , Best Buy ,etc .

Harmony Ultimate is what it is. It's good enough for most single zone systems. You can't customize anything so don't even try. "URC" covers a lot of different products these days. You would need to be more specific. In general you can completely customize the URC interfaces making the system exactly what you want it to be for your customer. It can adapt to your customer while your customer will have to adapt to Harmony.

Again...harmony is good for most single room systems but there is a lot of things i would get rid of like the fix it menu and some of the other buttons i wouldn't want a client to have to use.

But there is money in all the programming . Also I know RTI has a unit & Pro Control . Does anyone understand this question . Appreciate any advice at all , folks ,

There is money to be made with everything/anything. I paid a guy $100 to remove dog poop from my back yard. You can make money configuring a Harmony Ultimate system and you can make money installing the Harmony Ultimate system and you can make money designing the Harmony ultimate system and you can make money servicing the Harmony Ultimate system. Just not as much money as you can make selling URC. Not because URC is just over priced...it's because URC is the BMW 6 Series and Harmony is the Hyundai Elantra.

Another thing to think about is that Harmony is configured in the cloud. If that cloud ever vanishes one day your clients have to buy something else. IMO this isn't a big enough reason not to sell the product but its definitely an important bullet point for your cons list.

Kind Regards
Brian
Avid Stamp Collector - I really love 39 Cent Stamps
Post 11 made on Sunday October 11, 2015 at 11:38
Brad Humphrey
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On October 10, 2015 at 21:25, Lowhz said...
No, it means a bunch of CIs use Harmony. They get in, get out and get paid. Next job.

WOW!
And do you know how many jobs every year companies have to go and clean up, that these f^ hacks have done. And it's not just Harmony... Anytime I go to a new clients house, that has something already in place and 'supposedly' programmed, I cringe! Because more than likely some idiot spent a few minutes just throwing codes in a remote and a few macros and left "They get in, get out and get paid". They didn't give a $hit that the programming was $hit and frustrating for the customer to use, because their programming was $hit.
Back to Harmony = all the jobs I have ever seen involving these remotes, were in the above category.
Post 12 made on Sunday October 11, 2015 at 23:06
Ranger Home
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If the house has wheels on it, it gets a harmony remote. pretty simple logic.
Post 13 made on Monday October 12, 2015 at 00:22
goldenzrule
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On October 10, 2015 at 21:25, Lowhz said...
No, it means a bunch of CIs use Harmony. They get in, get out and get paid. Next job.

No, they get in, get on the clients network, pull up the Web based software, have software ask a bunch of questions, attempt to rearrange buttons to get them to display properly, upload to remote, test, fix some issues with the programming upload again again, test again....

Time speant, 30 minutes to an hour thanks to crappy Web based software.

CI goes in with MX780, opens CCP, programs completely stable and bulletproof program file with discreet commands in 15 minutes. Collects check, leaves HAPPY customer, and moves on to the next one.
Post 14 made on Monday October 12, 2015 at 02:26
tomciara
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On October 10, 2015 at 21:25, Lowhz said...
No, it means a bunch of CIs use Harmony. They get in, get out and get paid. Next job.

Because they either don't know something better exists, or don't have the smarts/drive/whatever it takes to learn a more capable system - capable of a far better client experience.
There is no truth anymore. Only assertions. The internet world has no interest in truth, only vindication for preconceived assumptions.
Post 15 made on Monday October 12, 2015 at 04:00
buzz
Super Member
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Sometimes there is push back from the customer. "I'm not going to pay THAT much for a remote!". Maybe, at that point in the negotiation there is a compromise at the price of a Harmony. The dynamic is that the customer has just saved money by talking the CI down.

There is also a technique to selling a remote system. I keep a demo remote handy and I'll pull it out, often dropping it in the customer's hands. It's a 30 second demo and you can quickly gauge the customer's response. (It's also most of the operating instructions they'll ever need too) If they see the value, the sale is done. If they don't go for it on the spot, there is a "bug" in their brain that things could be "easy" -- and it costs what it costs. I don't allow myself to be talked down to a Harmony. Harmony does not meet my requirement for being "easy" and after the install I'll be peppered with grumps and "how do I ...?".

And, some customers, will be perfectly happy using the cable remote.

I have a current customer who made plain up front that he did not want any remotes beyond the native remotes. It's not a case of money. He's building a 1.5 - 2.0M custom house with a pool on the second floor. He already has access to cameras, thermostats, and pool controls remotely. I think that it's a tech issue -- real men don't need fancy TV remotes. But, the TV systems have quite a few moving parts and one in particular is rather surly to operate. While he is capable of operating the mess, his wife is another story. We may yet get into premium remotes.
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