I'm solidly in the Lutron camp these days.  I think they've easily got the best selection of shading products and it makes sense to pair shades with their lighting control.  Lutron is also the only manufacturer I've ever seen specified by designers & architects, so in some cases not being able to provide it is a non-starter to bid the job.

I'm not a Crestron dealer, but for those that are I can see how staying with the Crestron product line for lighting, shade & control is the best approach.

Aside from a couple small billing issues I've not had any issues dealing with Lutron as a company.  I did have to jump through a few hoops to go direct and get the Homeworks line (I'm a small dealer), but they've always provided reliable products & great support.

The automation controller typically has a shorter life span than a Lutron lighting controller. No need to replace dimmers, when the HA controller craps out, and the manufacturer is switched.

I've been extraordinarily pleased with Lutron service. I've never gotten better support from a manufacturer. And, the local rep is top notch.

Also I can do a Lutron Homeworks QS system regardless if the client is getting Control4, Crestron, or no control system at all.

There are 10 different ways to look at it, just like anything else in this damned industry.

So when I was on a project where the lighting system was expanded, why did everything in the Lutron system have to be replaced with new stuff? The only thing that was left were the cans and the dimming modules in them. Key pads maestros, graphic eyes, processors, etc had to all be replaced.

QS was a major architectural change for HomeWorks. Up to and including HomeWorks Illumination all devices were backwards compatible--a 20-year lifecycle and pretty impressive compared to its peers (which for many years there were none). QS can still communicate with older H48 link devices--which would include Maestros--so not sure why you had to replace those. It can now (with HWQS 8.0) communicate with all older keypad generations back to and including HomeWorks Interactive. Wiring infrastructure requirements remain the same and have not changed since 1992.

We have completed minor expansions of existing HW Illumination and Interactive systems with HWQS and RA2 by using serial communication between the two processors. This has worked well and is fairly simple to implement.

My point is doing a 100 load lighting system via UPB vs a centralized system, Lutron, Crestron, Vantage is insane.

And FOX is the best news channel.

Greg, I must be insane, because I have done a few 100+ load systems on UPB, with Elan G and they all work quite well.

Have you done a 100+ UPB system before? If not, then I don't think you know what you are talking about.

To be clear these were retro fits, but they work quite well and as powerful as anything that Lutron can do (I have installed many Homework systems in the past, so I am privy to what HW is all about). Except crazy finish keypads... Lutron does have the advantage there.

Now if you are talking about centrally located dimmer panels on a new construction job...yeah UPB isn't quite as elegant, but even that can still be accomplished.

I did my first HomeWorks system in 1993 and followed up with many over the years. It's good stuff. But they are total cunts, and I prefer to give my biz to other deserving companies. If you want to be a Lutron pole dancer/smoker, feel free. But I'm not following you in that path. And if you want to call me crazy for that choice, so be it...I'm not that thin skinned. But I won't be their cheerleader or Ra Ra girl.

Quit trying to derail an on topic thread

I think it was a mistake for Lutron to release the QS version before making it compatible with the older versions. It was a very tough sale. Currently, I understand the maestro's can be left in and there is an interface coming out for the keypads.
On the flip side, i have a client that bought a house and wants to add all the dimmers and fans that were not controlled earlier, about 60 of them. Switching him to QS is more expensive, but should be a smother, simpler install.
It comes down to a comparison between HRD-XXX and the HQRA-XXX wireless dimmers.

Anyone have an opinion about the QS RF product and software?

Ive done several 100 load UPB installs without a hitch. So, no, not yanking chains. Not saying its always the best solution, just pointing out that is is one solution. And a solid one for me. Completely independent and runs on it own. It has its place.

Fox news? I thought MSNBC was the ONLY place for facts? No?

John and Tex, not saying it will not work, just saying it is not the best solution on new construction when you can do a centralized system. To quote Dr. Ian Malcom, (Juassic Park):Yeah, yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could that they didn't stop to think if they should. ;)

Most installed crestron lighting systems have their own dedicated processor. The AV (for example) processors can go down without taking the lighting system with it.

The only connection is an ethernet cable to the switch. Same as if it were a lutron or vantage system.

I'm a little late to the game but I'll cast in my two cents.

First in most large projects I've seen the clients spec the lighting and it almost always is Lutron. Typically the Lutron systems need to be programmed separate from the AV control system.

If it is a simple Grafik Eye keypad controller that I just need the serial number of it isn't a big deal.

I've found that dealing with lighting dealers is a major PITA. If they even answer the phone it is like pulling teeth to get the integration ID numbers. If the lighting is a Quantum I jack the LOE up and increase the cost by 15 points just because I know it's going to be an ordeal.

That said if given the choice I would spec a RMC3 to control a Crestron lighting system and use intersystem communications to network it to the main AV controller. It provides the redundancy and reduces labor and liability considerably.

In short I work with Lutron only when I have to and I would not at this time shed a tear if Lutron became the next Extron and died a quick death of irrelevancy.