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Topic:
What do we consider "vintage gear" these days?
This thread has 66 replies. Displaying posts 31 through 45.
Post 31 made on Sunday September 7, 2014 at 15:56
highfigh
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On September 7, 2014 at 13:05, Mr. Stanley said...
The Capeheart stuff is some of the coolest sh#t ever!!!

I was kind of partial to Pioneer's Centrex models. If you're not familiar, they were compact stereo systems with 1/4" thick speaker cabinets, BSR turntables mounted on top of the receiver, which had either a cassette deck or 8-Track player in the same case. It also had RCA plugs on the speaker wires.

Now, THAT was some great stuff.

And YES, I'm kidding.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 32 made on Sunday September 7, 2014 at 15:58
highfigh
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On September 7, 2014 at 10:05, tomciara said...
In our repair department, it was finicky and hard to make work well. For us, it was Accutrash.

There was also Junk-rard, RCA Victim, Hitrashi, Kenwouldn't, Sansewage... could go on.

Yeah, there was a lot of mediocre stuff out there. They love that crap at Audio Karma.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
OP | Post 33 made on Sunday September 7, 2014 at 20:15
davey28
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Back on topic, I still have some SAE gear. I'd consider it vintage and pretty darn good.
Post 34 made on Sunday September 7, 2014 at 20:53
highfigh
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On September 7, 2014 at 20:15, davey28 said...
Back on topic, I still have some SAE gear. I'd consider it vintage and pretty darn good.

Do you have the tuner with Nixie tubes for the display?
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 35 made on Sunday September 7, 2014 at 23:50
Ernie Gilman
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On September 6, 2014 at 22:13, highfigh said...
The amp in the link is similar to mine (it has the aluminum tube covers and extra grid wires) but I don't see the big 30uF caps that are in mine.

The aluminum tube covers are shields. Tube grids are where the signal is put into the tube, so they're not extra. They could be screen grids, though, which I believe were grounded or held at some other DC potential (ground is a DC potential of zero).

On September 7, 2014 at 15:58, highfigh said...
Yeah, there was a lot of mediocre stuff out there. They love that crap at Audio Karma.

Marantz had such a line. Its brand was Imperial and its front panel had -- woo woo! -- backlit magenta lettering.
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 36 made on Monday September 8, 2014 at 09:53
highfigh
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On September 7, 2014 at 23:50, Ernie Gilman said...
The aluminum tube covers are shields. Tube grids are where the signal is put into the tube, so they're not extra. They could be screen grids, though, which I believe were grounded or held at some other DC potential (ground is a DC potential of zero).

Marantz had such a line. Its brand was Imperial and its front panel had -- woo woo! -- backlit magenta lettering.

I know they're shields and I know the top grid isn't really 'extra', but since noval tube sockets weren't being used at that time, I meant that it's extra WRT octal sockets. I also know 'ground' is zero potential difference.

Magenta- early '80s? That would be the same time Sony had TV colors like mauve, taupe and teal.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 37 made on Monday September 8, 2014 at 19:05
Mr. Stanley
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Wish I still had my HH Scott tube integrated amp!
"If it keeps up, man will atrophy all his limbs but the push-button finger."
Frank Lloyd Wright
Post 38 made on Tuesday September 9, 2014 at 10:25
Hi-FiGuy
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On September 7, 2014 at 10:05, tomciara said...
In our repair department, it was finicky and hard to make work well. For us, it was Accutrash.

There was also Junk-rard, RCA Victim, Hitrashi, Kenwouldn't, Sansewage... could go on.

Flame Linear

Sorry Bruce
Post 39 made on Tuesday September 9, 2014 at 11:51
sirroundsound
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How about listening to Fresh Aire on a Revox Turntable in the 80's, does that make me vintage?
Post 40 made on Tuesday September 9, 2014 at 13:07
Mr. Stanley
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On September 9, 2014 at 10:25, Hi-FiGuy said...
Flame Linear

Sorry Bruce

How about Cardboard Hard-on?

NAD = nearly always defective

Donkey Show / Onkyo
"If it keeps up, man will atrophy all his limbs but the push-button finger."
Frank Lloyd Wright
Post 41 made on Tuesday September 9, 2014 at 13:41
Ernie Gilman
Yes, That Ernie!
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On September 8, 2014 at 09:53, highfigh said...
I know they're shields and I know the top grid isn't really 'extra',

Glad to hear that. When you called them "tube covers" and "extra grid wire" it didn't seem like you knew.

but since noval tube sockets weren't being used at that time, I meant that it's extra WRT octal sockets.

It didn't even occur to me that those might be octal sockets. The chassis I've seen that looked like that had six pin sockets with no center pin and tubes with numbers like the 35 or 37; the rectifier would be the 80 with four pins. The pins connected to the filaments on those tubes were thicker than the rest, making it hard to put them in wrong, but not impossible. The center pin of the octal and loctal tubes could not be put in wrong.

I also know 'ground' is zero potential difference.

Well, no offense meant. When I write, I write for the person I'm commenting to as well as to the rest of the guys who might run across this. To some it's a novel idea that ground is a DC potential of zero, just as it doesn't occur to most us that DC is a signal with a frequency of zero Hertz. I added that comment to answer their question "what do you mean by grounded or held at some other DC potential? How is ground a DC potential?"

There's a further argument that could be brought up, that "potential" can't be zero because potential indicates the presence of a level of energy.  But if you can have positive energy levels that are potentials, and negative energy levels that are potentials, it makes no sense to define potential as discontinuous, with the zero point not being potential. And zero is a level.

I also figure you know all that stuff I wrote above about earlier tube pins, but some others might not know it. And there were no nonal tubes as large as the ones in the chassis you showed.

Magenta- early '80s? That would be the same time Sony had TV colors like mauve, taupe and teal.

Yup, early 80s.  Maybe started in the late 70s.
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 42 made on Tuesday September 9, 2014 at 23:07
highfigh
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On September 9, 2014 at 13:41, Ernie Gilman said...
Glad to hear that. When you called them "tube covers" and "extra grid wire" it didn't seem like you knew.

It didn't even occur to me that those might be octal sockets. The chassis I've seen that looked like that had six pin sockets with no center pin and tubes with numbers like the 35 or 37; the rectifier would be the 80 with four pins. The pins connected to the filaments on those tubes were thicker than the rest, making it hard to put them in wrong, but not impossible. The center pin of the octal and loctal tubes could not be put in wrong.

Well, no offense meant. When I write, I write for the person I'm commenting to as well as to the rest of the guys who might run across this. To some it's a novel idea that ground is a DC potential of zero, just as it doesn't occur to most us that DC is a signal with a frequency of zero Hertz. I added that comment to answer their question "what do you mean by grounded or held at some other DC potential? How is ground a DC potential?"

There's a further argument that could be brought up, that "potential" can't be zero because potential indicates the presence of a level of energy.  But if you can have positive energy levels that are potentials, and negative energy levels that are potentials, it makes no sense to define potential as discontinuous, with the zero point not being potential. And zero is a level.

I also figure you know all that stuff I wrote above about earlier tube pins, but some others might not know it. And there were no nonal tubes as large as the ones in the chassis you showed.

Yup, early 80s.  Maybe started in the late 70s.

The rectifier is 80, V1 is 6C8G and the mixer is 6Q7G and as I think I mentioned, the output tube is 6L6G. I recapped it and replaced the power cord and fired it up without tubes, to make sure the power transformer secondary and heater voltage was correct, then loaded the rectifier. Bupkis. No B+, so I went to Ebay and looked- found someone selling three which, according to him, all worked. Got them for $18.50, shipped. Put the first one in and saw it glow, so I let it warm up before checking the B+, which was right where it should be, according to the data for the other tubes. I then inserted V1, V2 and V3, checking voltages as I went. Once they were all in and warmed up, I plugged a cable in and touched the tip- not much. Bummer. Went up to my computer to look at the data for V1 and V2- turns out, they had been in the wrong positions- I removed them and placed them on my bench in the same order as they were in the amp. I swapped them and when I touched the tip, it was a lot louder. The volume control has a spot that's a bit crunchy from sitting for who know how long, but it sounds great. I assume the rectifier went bad and the owner removed the tubes and took them to the local drug store or TV repair shop to have them tested, giving up when they may not have been able to buy one, or afford it. At some point, someone was shooting BBs at it and I found a few inside of the chassis. I noticed the little dents on the front before I heard them rolling around.

It came with a full set of KenRad tubes, which were probably original and they look very good- not bad for almost 80 years old.

I don't assume others know tube amps, so I called them 'covers'.

According to this site ([Link: tdsl.duncanamps.com]), the 80, 6Q7G and 6L6G were introduced in 1936 and the 6C8G was introduced in 1937- I don't know how long they were available before the would have been used in products brought to market, but it's possible that this amp was made in '37. Since it has 1/4" jacks, using the tubes for dating it seems to be the most accurate, due to the lack of EIA product codes (which began in 1941).

Nonal (often called 'noval') tubes seem to have been produced after this amp was made. It also would have been produced during the Hawaiian music fad of the 1920s-1930s.

WRT ground and potential, if the chassis is used as the shield and grounding plane, any points with connections to it should be at ground potential or, as it's sometimes known, equipotential, meaning no potential difference and therefore, OV between the connections because voltage is potential energy. I think some become confused when discussing LowZ balanced audio when the ground plane for the audio is "floated" above the ground plane for the power supply.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 43 made on Wednesday September 10, 2014 at 00:32
Ernie Gilman
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highfigh,
that's all great, and great stuff.

I found a reference to the 80 at [Link: radiomuseum.org], which says it was introduced in 1926.

I'd thought the 80 was older than the thirties, based on it being in my favorite AM radio, a Philco TRF with four stages of RF amplification and WOW a tuning capacitor that tracked. I got WLS in Chicago on that, in Los Angeles, with a 20 foot length of wire and a ground. It went south slowly, then quit. ALL of the filter capacitors and cathode bias capacitors were in one unlabeled tin box. It was too late to try to work out what the capacitance values were and I couldn't find a Sams on it. Oh, well.

I forgot that there were five pin tubes, too, that pretty much HAD to be triodes. Two pins for filament, one each for plate, grid and cathode. Simple.

Thanks. This is fun.
A good answer is easier with a clear question giving the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 44 made on Wednesday September 10, 2014 at 10:37
highfigh
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On September 10, 2014 at 00:32, Ernie Gilman said...
highfigh,
that's all great, and great stuff.

I found a reference to the 80 at [Link: radiomuseum.org], which says it was introduced in 1926.

I'd thought the 80 was older than the thirties, based on it being in my favorite AM radio, a Philco TRF with four stages of RF amplification and WOW a tuning capacitor that tracked. I got WLS in Chicago on that, in Los Angeles, with a 20 foot length of wire and a ground. It went south slowly, then quit. ALL of the filter capacitors and cathode bias capacitors were in one unlabeled tin box. It was too late to try to work out what the capacitance values were and I couldn't find a Sams on it. Oh, well.

I forgot that there were five pin tubes, too, that pretty much HAD to be triodes. Two pins for filament, one each for plate, grid and cathode. Simple.

Thanks. This is fun.

Quite a few 5 pin rectifiers, too. 5U4, 5AR4/GZ34, 5Y3, 5R5, 5V4, etc.

Lots of contradictory info out there.

Re: your Philco- you could have looked at the tube manuals for rectifier info or a tube circuits book from Western Electric, RCA, ATT, etc. I doubt they used a proprietary circuit for much of anything and if it has/had a label inside like this link, it would have been easy enough. That is, if the internet was available. If you still have it, it shouldn't be hard to do. 30uF was common, since the plate voltages were lower than in later models. The bypass caps were probably 25uF/25VDC or 25uF/50VDC unless it was for the input tube and lower frequencies were desired. My Fender Bassman has a 250uF/6VDC bypass cap for the input.

My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 45 made on Wednesday September 10, 2014 at 14:20
Mr. Stanley
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On September 9, 2014 at 11:51, sirroundsound said...
How about listening to Fresh Aire on a Revox Turntable in the 80's, does that make me vintage?

Oh yeah! Or Lincoln Mayorga on mobile fidelity? Those albums sold a lot of speakers for me back then, how about you?
"If it keeps up, man will atrophy all his limbs but the push-button finger."
Frank Lloyd Wright
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