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OT- Article Comparing Tesla & Tucker From 2008 - They were really wrong
This thread has 147 replies. Displaying posts 61 through 75.
Post 61 made on Tuesday July 22, 2014 at 19:42
Mr. Stanley
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On July 22, 2014 at 18:15, Anthony said...
exactly. The car is idle for many hours at home it does not make sense to go out of your way and wait just to charge it even if it is free and relatively fast. This is more about options (if someone wants to drive long distances) and peace of mind (what if I can't make it back home)

are you sure about that? The only thing I ever read is them saying that one day it might be possible

By 2020. The new $35,000 model will do 300 miles.
"If it keeps up, man will atrophy all his limbs but the push-button finger."
Frank Lloyd Wright
Post 62 made on Tuesday July 22, 2014 at 19:45
Mr. Stanley
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On July 20, 2014 at 18:40, Fins said...
So you need an expert to review audio gear, but they don't have to be an expert to review anything else? That's just plain stupid of an argument. Either they know what they are doing, or they don't. You don't get to have it both ways and pick the ones that you agree with.

Explain? CR has been reviewing autos forever and they have a hell of a good handle on car reviews. Teams of experts.


What blows me away are the attacks of the Conservative Media outlets agains the electric cars. Why? Less oil consumption? Less gas taxes collectable?
"If it keeps up, man will atrophy all his limbs but the push-button finger."
Frank Lloyd Wright
Post 63 made on Tuesday July 22, 2014 at 19:56
Fins
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Then I guess they do great at reviewing audio equipment too.
Civil War reenactment is LARPing for people with no imagination.

Post 64 made on Saturday July 26, 2014 at 09:33
Anthony
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On July 22, 2014 at 19:42, Mr. Stanley said...
By 2020. The new $35,000 model will do 300 miles.

maybe. I agree that batteries and motors will get better with time, but Tesla couldn't even get the model X out on time why put too much faith in something that far in the future?
...
Post 65 made on Saturday July 26, 2014 at 10:04
Anthony
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On July 22, 2014 at 19:56, Fins said...
Then I guess they do great at reviewing audio equipment too.

that does not make any sense. I won't get into details of what I think of CR again since I already did so in this thread and I am not taking sides, but if someone said "I had great grades in A class" would you respond "I guess he must have done great in B class"?

Think about it, if the same person is setting up the test criteria for both A and B can't he know more about A and so come up with a better basis to test A over B and so the final results will be better (closer to reality) for A rather than B? And if they are different people that are in charge can't it be even more so since not only do you have the individuals knowledge of the subject matter but also their competency at running the test.

This reminds of a situation many years ago. It was about audio (can't remember what codecs was used/discussed at the time) and some guy had done a test and compared a lossy compression to a lossless and said he could not tell the difference between the two. When I asked what audio he used to compare he said he said he wanted simple stuff so that he could hear the differences. But when comparing codecs that is the worst way to go, it is like saying "I want to know if more money makes a difference so I went into the dollar store, bought a single 1$ item with 5$ in my pocket and later went back with 100$ in my pocket to get that 1$ item and there was no difference between the two. A lossy codec is not there to mangle the audio but to keep the bitrate down, so going with something that can easily be compressed and has so little sound that it can easily be lowered to the given threshold without loss at that given bitrate might make the testers job easier but makes the test completely useless. What you want is complex sound that would force the encoder to try and compress I, any codec at any bitrate could do justice of complete silence.

...
Post 66 made on Saturday July 26, 2014 at 14:30
Mario
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On July 26, 2014 at 09:33, Anthony said...
maybe. I agree that batteries and motors will get better with time, but Tesla couldn't even get the model X out on time why put too much faith in something that far in the future?

If RTI has anything to do with it than it'll be out in 2 weeks.
Post 67 made on Saturday July 26, 2014 at 14:33
Mr. Stanley
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On July 26, 2014 at 10:04, Anthony said...
that does not make any sense. I won't get into details of what I think of CR again since I already did so in this thread and I am not taking sides, but if someone said "I had great grades in A class" would you respond "I guess he must have done great in B class"?

Think about it, if the same person is setting up the test criteria for both A and B can't he know more about A and so come up with a better basis to test A over B and so the final results will be better (closer to reality) for A rather than B? And if they are different people that are in charge can't it be even more so since not only do you have the individuals knowledge of the subject matter but also their competency at running the test.

This reminds of a situation many years ago. It was about audio (can't remember what codecs was used/discussed at the time) and some guy had done a test and compared a lossy compression to a lossless and said he could not tell the difference between the two. When I asked what audio he used to compare he said he said he wanted simple stuff so that he could hear the differences. But when comparing codecs that is the worst way to go, it is like saying "I want to know if more money makes a difference so I went into the dollar store, bought a single 1$ item with 5$ in my pocket and later went back with 100$ in my pocket to get that 1$ item and there was no difference between the two. A lossy codec is not there to mangle the audio but to keep the bitrate down, so going with something that can easily be compressed and has so little sound that it can easily be lowered to the given threshold without loss at that given bitrate might make the testers job easier but makes the test completely useless. What you want is complex sound that would force the encoder to try and compress I, any codec at any bitrate could do justice of complete silence.


+1 Fins is one of those guys who hates Teslas and the CEO... There are a lot of them out there (Tesla haters)...
"If it keeps up, man will atrophy all his limbs but the push-button finger."
Frank Lloyd Wright
Post 68 made on Monday April 4, 2016 at 14:23
Mr. Stanley
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Everybody talking about grid overload. Solar needs to be on every roof in the country.

This IS 2016.
"If it keeps up, man will atrophy all his limbs but the push-button finger."
Frank Lloyd Wright
Post 69 made on Monday April 4, 2016 at 16:12
highfigh
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On April 4, 2016 at 14:23, Mr. Stanley said...
Everybody talking about grid overload. Solar needs to be on every roof in the country.

This IS 2016.

Who'll be able to pay what the power companies will need to charge? It costs a certain amount for them to stay in business, as they sit. If people use less of the utility's energy, they'll need to charge more per kilowatt hour. We Energies used to have an on-hold message with "Did you know that WE Energy's prices are some of the lowest in the Midwest?", but that ended over 5 years ago. Now, they're one of the most expensive, behind Michigan. This article shows one of the problems here- they have increased rates every year, by about 3-4%. They say they needed to increase capacity due to higher demand, but the Oak Creek coal-fired plant wasn't wanted by the residents and as it turned out, it wasn't needed. What was the result? A rate increase, because they said the demand wasn't there. They insisted on using coal and after it was built, the EPA came in and fined them for not having enough scrubbers on the stacks. Rate increase. They did their usual "It's good enough" for the ash dump and it slid into Lake Michigan. Rate increase. This Winter was more mild than usual and we used less natural gas, so I guess it's time for another rate increase.

[Link: wuwm.com]

They don't make it easy to add solar here and that's the way they like it- why would they want to give up their monopoly? 20 states can show for power, but WI isn't one of them.
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 70 made on Monday April 4, 2016 at 19:35
BizarroTerl
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Tesla mis-planned the demand for the Tesla 3. They had ~260K preorders and Musk said that they planned on 1/4 to 1/3 of that. Now pre orders are over 300K. Looks like Tesla is a success (profitability is expected in 2016).
Post 71 made on Tuesday April 5, 2016 at 10:55
highfigh
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[Link: news.com.au]
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 72 made on Tuesday April 5, 2016 at 12:02
Daniel Tonks
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LOL, what a sensationalist headline! Clearly they're looking for clickbiat, as everyone goes "whaaaaa?" based on what they already know.

Frankly, it's quite deceptive: headline talks about "poor sales" but the article then talks about "shipped just 14,820 vehicles during the first quarter ... well short of the 16,000 it had targeted three months ago ...  impacted by severe Model X supplier parts shortages".

That's not poor sales, that's poor delivery - and I'm sure the folks waiting for the 1,180 missed production cars didn't go poof overnight (and is 92.6% really "well short"?). Especially since "once Tesla got the parts ... it cranked out 750 Model X’s during the last week of March."

Gee. Horrific news to be sure!
Post 73 made on Tuesday April 5, 2016 at 13:49
Ranger Home
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On April 4, 2016 at 16:12, highfigh said...
What was the result? A rate increase,

"your energy costs will necessarily skyrocket"

Direct quote. and fools still re-elected him.
Post 74 made on Tuesday April 5, 2016 at 15:47
highfigh
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On April 5, 2016 at 13:49, Ranger Home said...
"your energy costs will necessarily skyrocket"

Direct quote. and fools still re-elected him.

Unfortunately, these increases had nothing to do with Obama's Cap And Trade policies, they were happening before he was elected the first time. I use less energy than ever and my bills are larger than before I started using energy efficient devices. I bought new kitchen appliances and they (Amana) didn't qualify for rebates, even though they're the same as the Whirlpool and Maytag equivalents, which did qualify.

It's insanity, I tells ya!
My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder."
Post 75 made on Wednesday April 6, 2016 at 13:26
Trunk-Slammer -Supreme
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I wonder how many studies have been done relating to the battery pack replacement cost on a Tesla, and at how many miles is the original pack estimated to last.

I do know that on the Ford Fusion Hybrid, a replacement batter pack is estimated to be about 3 to 4k from Ford, and the warranty is only for 8/100,000, unless you're in California where it's 10/150,000.

Factor that cost in along with the required charging costs, and maybe the Tesla isn't really all that attractive?


I still like the idea of the Tesla though. comparable cost to many other nice cars for the newest model, and it would get me to the beach with ease.

But, then again, what abut a road trip from Seattle to the NC coast? There I see a problem.


FWIW: We've had the Fusion Hybrid for long enough, and miles enough, for me to say "It's a winner!". Averaging 46 miles per gallon city and highway, and doing it in a pretty luxurious car.
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