Agreed. I left her a message to call back tomorrow. We'll see if I can turn this around yet.

Not to piss on everyones opinion but as you stated, you are not a fortress dealer. Even though you talked to them and will be getting the dealer paperwork, Fortress probably has the opinion that you are going to make one order and no more. I think this is where the entire problem is arising from. If you were in Fortress' position, would you like to make one sale with a question mark on future sales or honor the dealer that has made many sales in the past already? Everyone gets mad when a mfg rep signs up every dealer in an area for an electronics line because then it comes down to who is willing to discount the most. Nobody wins but the client over the inevitable price war. Why is it different for furniture?

We are a Fortress dealer and on many occasions when we have bid out chairs for theaters, the ID on the project will call fortress trying to become a dealer for that one job because the owner loves fortress but the ID cannot get them. The ID usually has no intention of consistent repeat business. Because everything is made to order at Fortress, if two quote requests come in for the same configuration from the same geographic area it's probably not a coincidence. Fortress will call us to let us know what is happening, not once though have they ever given us a discount to pass on to the client to get the sale. I think the "manufacturer discount" is BS and the competitor is discounting it himself to gain the sale.

Everyone is always complaining about how manufacturers whore out the lines and create situations where nobody makes margin but Fortress from what little information we have in this situation has done just the opposite.

Flame on.

No need to flame, just disagree, to a point. In actuality, I agree with much of what you said. However, it is not the manufacturers place to call and inform people when a competitor is asking for prices. That is overstepping their boundaries. If they are trying to keep the line from getting in the hands of multiple dealers in the same geographical area, then simply map the areas and inform him the line has an area rep/dealer they can work with. This was indeed an unethical move of the manufacturers part.

Erik you are correct in everything you stated but why would Fortress tell them to discount their product. Sounds very panicky to me.

I'd do installation gratis. It's chairs.

In my post I wrote that I don't think Fortress did discount it. It is my opinion that the competing dealer is discounting it out of there own profit margin and just saying that Fortress is. It makes the competing dealer look bad if all the sudden they come back and say they can discount it. It causes the client to pause and say "why didn't they offer that price from the start?"

 I've gotta agree with Erik on this one.  Let's look at it from the other dealer and Fortress' point of view.  

Registered Fortress dealer already quoted the job.  Then comes along you at ABC company.  You're calling about information to sign up and make an order.  

I'm just playing devil's advocate here, and I don't believe this to be the truth. (Let's make that perfectly clear).  But, as far as Fortress knows, you're some guy they found on Craigslist, you're trying to undercut a reputable Fortress Dealer and Fortress and/or the dealer doesn't want that to happen.  

Again, I'm not saying this is fact..all I'm saying is they don't know that it's not fact.  

Afterall, they already quoted the sale...before they'd ever been contacted by you.  


Long story short, if I was pissed at anyone, I'd be pissed at 

1. The Interior Decorator for not having enough brains to think that a company who can handle a large home theater  that has 40k worth of chairs in it couldn't also provide 40k worth of chairs.   She obviously knows that home theater companies supply chairs because she contacted the other place already, why didn't she contact you first?

2. Pissed at myself for not making absolutely sure that the Interior Designer  wasn't made aware that your company expects to supply everything pertaining to the home theater.  

To me, it sounds like simple miscommunication.  I'd take some time to take the ID to lunch and make it perfectly clear what the individual roles are.  Lighting, movie posters, sound dampening, etc.  

Not trying to beat you up, and I feel your pain.  But I think this is a simple case of a vendor trying to take care of a registered dealer.

The issue is not with Fortress offering a discount to the other dealer. The issue is that Fortress actually took "insider" confidential information from a potential new dealer and handed it off to an existing dealer so they could get a sale.

Absolutely nothing above board about that move. Super shady wallstreetesque behavior. Most likely the fault of that single Sales guy and not part of the companies standard operating procedure.

Adding...

How the heck did Fortress know who this was for in the first place? Is everyone using the same spec sheet? I just helped wrap up a $50mil home and i can tell you that not 1 single vendor of ours knows where any of their product went.

ErikS, I agree with you on some points. Where I find their actions unethical is informing a competitor of our intent to compete having said to me on the phone that they would welcome me with open arms. If you have no intention of selling to us, say so, maintain professional confidentiality and let your dealer win the job on their merits.

It is unethical to offer to make us a dealer then actively move against us to ensure we don't get the sale. I would also point out that an ID trying to get an account is one thing but we are a reputable AV dealer with no intention of signing up just for one sale. We have direct lines with most manufacturers and seating is one area we do not. This was a prime chance for them to be the company to fill that hole in our line up.

This is quite simply not good business practice. How "not good" is questionable but that it is unethical is not debatable. I also think your company is complicit in the poor practice by taking their calls. Not suggesting you are consciously being complicit but maybe you just haven't thought about it because it works in your favor. With a shoe on the other foot would you feel the same?

I think Lutron handles this in a similar style when it comes to HomeWorks.
If a Dealer "registers" a job with Lutron, Lutron will only back that dealer on that job.

I don't know if that includes informing the dealer of other attempts to register that job. -It sounds similar to what Fortress does.

FWIW Axis does the same thing with IP cams.

I understand what Fortress did, but I don't think they did it the right way. They should have told you up front that they would not quote you for the seating because of the other dealer. They should not have shared any information with the existing dealer. I would have a lot more respect for a response like that.

Sounds like Lutron.. lol. don't ever let your rep know what projects you are working on or you will suddenly have competition.

In the world of business that I come from, where hundreds of millions can be at stake based on someone learning something they shouldn't, we use the legal system to help stop these problems from happening.

Before we will do business with someone, we have them sign an NDA. In it they agree to not disclose information about our product, customers, pricing, basically anything they learn from us. If someone won't sign this document, we don't do business with them for reasons like the one you had occur. My guess is that the dealer agreement they would have had you sign likely would have contained a mutual NDA, and would have stopped you from disclosing things like their pricing, and they would have been unable to disclose what they learned from you. If they disclose something protected under the agreement, you are free to pursue legal action, and they likely would have ended up paying you any profit you would have made on the sale, and often punitive damages in addition.

The business practice shouldn't require an NDA, but without it, legally there is nothing that stops them from doing what they did. You are correct in what they did makes a used car salesman look like an angel.

Here's this after just reading the first post:

Ask the client what he expect will happen when a seat needs repair and a company that will stab a dealer in the back is called on to provide service. See, they were going to get the sale either way, so it was of no advantage to them to do what they did. At the time of service, service will cost them money. If they are jerks when no money is involved, how about when it costs them something?

Ask him if he thinks the chair company will stay in business and even be around to fix the things!  Chairs, particularly motorized, are very custom affairs and if the company is gone the chair is a lame duck.

I have dealt with [names business friends], who make excellent products, regarding chairs, and they would never do something like that.  If it turns out it was them, let me know.  I'll be stunned but I will personally slap the owner!