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OT: Running Electrical to a kitchen island
This thread has 20 replies. Displaying posts 1 through 15.
Post 1 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 13:25
cgav
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I am remodeling our kitchen. We are putting in an island (48x60) and per code, we have to have electrical there. We are on a slab foundation. I'm not against doing this myself, but what the best way to do this? Obviously it has to be in a pipe and bury the pipe. Can this be accomplished with a powered SDS drill with a spade bit or am I going to have to rent a concrete saw and a jackhammer?

Or should I just "hire a pro"? Any clue on what that might run price wise?
Post 2 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 13:40
SB Smarthomes
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You don't want to chisel this out.  Make parallel cuts using a circular saw and concrete cutting blade, then break it out with your chisel.  I have this done by the general contractors crew on jobs all the time.  They don't use special concrete saws for small jobs like this, just a standard 7" circular saw with diamond blade and use a water bottle to wet the cut a bit and keep the dust down if this is an issue.

Once you have the cuts made, the concrete will break out fairly easily.  Lay in your conduit and then fill back in with concrete mix.
www.sbsmarthomes.com
Santa Barbara Smarthomes
Post 3 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 13:59
cpchillin
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On February 5, 2012 at 13:40, SB Smarthomes said...
You don't want to chisel this out.  Make parallel cuts using a circular saw and concrete cutting blade, then break it out with your chisel.  I have this done by the general contractors crew on jobs all the time.  They don't use special concrete saws for small jobs like this, just a standard 7" circular saw with diamond blade and use a water bottle to wet the cut a bit and keep the dust down if this is an issue.

Once you have the cuts made, the concrete will break out fairly easily.  Lay in your conduit and then fill back in with concrete mix.

This is the best answer! It's easy but it will make a bit of dust.
Who says you can't put 61" plasmas up on cantilever mounts using toggle bolts? <---Thanks Ernie ;)
Post 4 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 14:35
GLS
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On February 5, 2012 at 13:40, SB Smarthomes said...
You don't want to chisel this out.  Make parallel cuts using a circular saw and concrete cutting blade, then break it out with your chisel.  I have this done by the general contractors crew on jobs all the time.  They don't use special concrete saws for small jobs like this, just a standard 7" circular saw with diamond blade and use a water bottle to wet the cut a bit and keep the dust down if this is an issue.

Once you have the cuts made, the concrete will break out fairly easily.  Lay in your conduit and then fill back in with concrete mix.

This will work just fine, but make sure you go deep enough to have 2" of concrete over the conduit. Also, use UF cable in the pipe, since it is considered a wet location. (condensation will make the pipe very wet). Regular NM cable (romex) isn't rated for wet locations and could rot out in time.
www.GordonsLight.com
"As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another" Proverbs 27:17
Post 5 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 15:01
Neurorad
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Talk to the AHJ, to make sure it's required. Some exceptions can be made for this requirement.

Of course, I'd want it there myself.
TB A+ Partner
Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha
Post 6 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 15:24
Audiophiliac
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Run some conduit for the tv you will install in the island on a lift. ;)
"When I eat, it is the food that is scared." - Ron Swanson
Post 7 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 15:35
bcf1963
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If you want to put in the island, and don't see the need for electrical, there is a way around the code requirement.

There is not a code requirement for a piece of furniture! If you don't attach the unit to the floor, then it is furniture, and code requirements do not play a role.

Honestly, if you are putting in the island, it is probably best to bite the bullet, and get electrical there. Just wanted to make you aware of how to sidestep the code requirement.
Post 8 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 16:28
highfigh
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On February 5, 2012 at 13:25, cgav said...
I am remodeling our kitchen. We are putting in an island (48x60) and per code, we have to have electrical there. We are on a slab foundation. I'm not against doing this myself, but what the best way to do this? Obviously it has to be in a pipe and bury the pipe. Can this be accomplished with a powered SDS drill with a spade bit or am I going to have to rent a concrete saw and a jackhammer?

Or should I just "hire a pro"? Any clue on what that might run price wise?

Does your floor have radiant heating? If you cut the slab, you'll be cutting that, too, unless you get lucky.
"People are bastard coated bastards, with bastard filling"
Post 9 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 16:57
tweeterguy
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You better make sure you dont have a post tension slab. If you hit a tendon the last thing you're going to worry about is whether your island has a code compliant electrical outlet. If you don't know what this is, you should hire a pro to confirm. Most have a stamp in the garage indicating as such.
- Chris
Post 10 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 17:54
Ernie Gilman
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All excellent advice. If you take the route of asking the AHJ, learn several approaches first so that you can tell him that you know of several ways to do it but would like to know from him a)what he prefers and b)if there is a less expensive but acceptable way to do it.

The AHJ will feel like you're listning to him, putting you on a better footing with him on all aspects of what he has to inspect, and he might come up with an idea we haven't thought of.

bcf, around here, all islands worth doing have sinks in them, so, there's plumbing, so, these can't be pieces of furniture unless there's a floor sink (as in restaurants to allow reconfiguration). Come to think of it, though, cgav didn't mention this, and it's much harder to get plumbing to the middle of the floor in a slab than to get electrical there.
We can't give you a good answer, or maybe any, without the make and model of everything.
"The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." -- G. “Bernie” Shaw
Post 11 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 18:30
mcn779
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If it were me I would put in more electrical than I could imagine using.
OP | Post 12 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 19:42
cgav
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Thanks guys. I know I need electrical there. It's a pretty big island. As much as I'd just rather not deal with it, I know we'd end up hating that big of an island with no electrical.

We're not doing a sink as we don't really need another sink, the island will only be 42" from the current sink and we never do prepwork on the other side of the kitchen (it's got a desk)

Is there a way to know (other than the stamp in the garage) if I've got a post tension slab?
Post 13 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 20:20
GLS
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Is your house a single family home, slab on grade? I've never heard of a residential post tension slab, except maybe in a high rise condo.

If possible, I'd make it a dedicated circuit too. That way whatever you run out there will have plenty of power.
www.GordonsLight.com
"As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another" Proverbs 27:17
Post 14 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 20:59
tweeterguy
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On February 5, 2012 at 19:42, cgav said...
Is there a way to know (other than the stamp in the garage) if I've got a post tension slab?

I believe they X-ray for it; if a stamp isn't present or you don't have the original engineering plans. Trust me you do not want to pay guesswork with this.

Is your house a single family home, slab on grade? I've never heard of a residential post tension slab, except maybe in a high rise condo.

We have post tension slabs on single family residences all over Vegas; I used to have a home with this...built in 2008.
- Chris
Post 15 made on Sunday February 5, 2012 at 21:13
thecapnredfish
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Not trying to be a SA, but if you are worried about meeting code, and asking how to get wire through concrete you should hire a pro. The diamond blade, some water, shop vac, hammer and concrete chisel should do the trick. messy job. run 2 conduits while you have it torn apart for anything else in the future. What about water and drain?
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