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Topic:
Cables - where and how
This thread has 17 replies. Displaying posts 1 through 15.
Post 1 made on Monday April 15, 2002 at 07:57
Dave Goodfellow
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63
OK, I am not strictly speaking a custom installer, although I count myself as a custom installer for my house.

I have the usual plethora of kit.
Denon 3802
Arcam DV88
Pansonic Video
Proline Video
Sky
Pronto
+ a couple of others

All cables are run to the room through the wall cavity e.g. TV Aerial, Sky Downlead, FM Aerial. I also have a coax running from the sky box back up the cavity to feed an amplifier which routes signals to 2 other rooms. There is also cabling for line feeds for 2nd zone on the Denon to feed audio to ceiling mounted speakers in bathroom.

All the speaker leads and TV signal leads run from the stack to Speakers/TV in trunking chased into the concrete floor.

I have a Glass shelved Hi-fi stand that looks good, with all the kit on it. My question is:

What do I do with all those cables that make it look a mess?

What would you guys do? I have spent time wiring the rest of the house nicely but I haven't found a suitable solution for the rats nest behind the shelves.

Do I fix trunking down the back of the shelves and still end up with a mess at the bottom. Do I wall mount larger trunking to allow for some excess cable length? Do I make a custom wall box that includes power sockets and slots at each shelf level to run cables to specific devices. What do I make the wallbox out of. Wood? Plastering round the cable slots would be difficult to make look good, but it could be painted to match the room.

What trunking products do you use.

Help would be appreciated from the pro's. I do want it to look better than good.

Thanks in advance

Dave Goodfellow
Post 2 made on Monday April 15, 2002 at 10:32
dire1973
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April 2002
13
A lot of our customers prefer that there wires be hidden so I usually use a rack like a bellogetti that has a wire run down the back of it that hides the wires. anything going into the wall I use work boxes with the proper face plates and if they don;t make one for the interconnect I am using then I make one out of a blank plate and a dremel. Also if you go the blank plate dremel approach you can put several cables into one wall plate.
OP | Post 3 made on Monday April 15, 2002 at 11:57
Dave Goodfellow
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Dire1973?

The Bellogoti stand I just looked at looks good, not ready to replace mine just yet. Unfortunately my stand doesn't allow the cables to run down the legs, they just hang down the back. Can you really fit everything down the legs, plus the spare. Don't tell me you custom make every Phono/Scart lead the right length. Coax and Power I could believe but not all of them.

Have used blanking plates for aerial sockets etc.
One TV Downlead
One TV Return
One FM Radio
One Sky (no socket) just a hole. The sky guys recommend not breaking the downlead cable for digital, anyone done it? All through one blanking plate. Telephone in adjacent box. Dremel is just the thing, what did I do before it?

Just looking for some ideas to hide the spaghetti linking device to device. You can get a couple of ready made cable routing solutions for this sort of thing but most of them are either horrible to look at or too small for the amount cables in a full system.
Would also like to separate power/coax/phono cables.

I am wondering about making a wooden cabinet to fix to the wall with a slot at the level of each shelf to run cables to each box. Have three channels in the box to separate Power/Coax/Phono. Then install all the cables with the relevant slack to connect to the device. Place stand against wall/cabinet and connect each device up.

This would look neat but would have to plug in devices semi-blind. Would have to disconnect all devices to move the rack or run new cables. Not the end of the world.

In PC racks you can get hinge mechanisms to allow the PCs to pulled out and slid back without pulling the cables out. Dell version allows it 15 times and then the power cable pulls out, don't think this is a feature though?

Just wondered if someone made good quality items like this to save me spending time cutting/sanding/jointing/varnishing to make a custom product.

Thanks for the pointers, anyone else got anymore?

Dave
Post 4 made on Monday April 15, 2002 at 20:08
Larry Fine
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Here's an idea:

Attach a piece of cloth, color to suit (black, maybe), to the back edge of each shelf. Each piece should be the width of either the shelf or 17 inches (average equipment width), or somewhere between, if you prefer. The length of each piece of cloth should be a couple of inches longer than the distance to the shelf below.

Now, picture this from the side: With the cables hanging off the back edge of each shelf, they will be behind the cloth behind the next space down.

The cloth flaps will look like slats, with the wire always behind them. One requirement is that the cables are not custom-length, but are long enough to hang downward enough to not bunch up the cloth.

Of course, the cloth could be replaced with other materials, from colored paper or cardboard to pieces of plastic or even mirrored mylar. I guess you could use glass mirrors, but you'd need extra-strong tape (like good packing tape for glass shelves) or whatever you use.

Now that I think of it, if the appearance was okay, a slatted window shutter or louvered panel. Just make sure the slats are flexible enough to pass the plugs between them.

Keep the power cables to the sides, since almost all components have the power cables emerging from one end or the other. I use one power strip on each rear leg of my equipment rack, so the power cords don't have to cross the rack.

You can buy Velcro strips made for binding rolled-up cords and hoses. These will hold the power cords together and away from the signal cables, which could be similarly wrapped if they're stiff enough to not hang limply away from the power cords without them.


As for the cables running into and out of the walls, the quantity of cable should be the deciding factor.

Unless insisted upon by a customer, or the equipment rack really will be moved often, I prefer the direct, cable out-of-the-wall method. In my opinion, even though they look elegant and professional, plates with multitudes of jacks may actually affect signal quality, as they provide yet another point(s) where you may have a loose or poor connection. (Expensive, too)

You can use single- or double-gang low-voltage "boxes", which are backless boxes, so it's easier to route the wires into the wall without extra cable bending. They can be found with the pivoting 'ears'
which makes them "old-work boxes" or with nailing brackets for new work.

Again, depending on the size of the cable bundle, you can use a blank plate custom drilled with one or more holes, a plate made for single (not duplex) receptacles (they come in several different hole-sizes), or even a Decora-type plate.

Of course, the British hardware may be a bit different.

Larry
www.fineelectricco.com
OP | Post 5 made on Wednesday April 17, 2002 at 06:36
Dave Goodfellow
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Larry,

The cloth idea would not work very well for me. Unfortunately you can see the side and some of the back of my stand. It would work very well in some setups though.

The boxes. Good idea.

Unfortunately the stack sits at a point where an old door has been blocked up. Noggins between the stud work could mean ripping half the wall off. Oh and part of it is brick.

But the wall does jut out to make room for a porch the other side and the cavity wall. So the stack has a rear wall and a 6inch side wall to work with.

I was wondering about stud work and plaster to make a tall box in the corner. But couldn't think how to do the outlets. Pastering openings? I could build in wall boxes to make the openings and plaster the rest, paint to match the rest of the room. Covers over the wall box..Holes for cables. I like this idea.

Can't think of backless boxes over here but Dremel will take care of that.

Or Chrome tubes ran from the floor up.

This seems less intrusive than the original wooden tall box.

Thanks again Larry.

Will discuss with the customer(wife) and show samples at the weekend. You think your customers are difficult. It has taken 9 months to choose a new fireplace.

Regards

Dave Goodfellow




This message was edited by Dave Goodfellow on 04/17/02 06:57.59.
Post 6 made on Tuesday April 23, 2002 at 22:29
joe sexton
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March 2002
206
I recommend split loom, like what they use in cars around wire looms. It is a plastic tubing with ribs so it can stretch/bend and has a slit down the side to put wires in it. that usually makes the mess look like one big thick wire and looks a thousand times better and it looks professional rather then a piece of cloth that you can still see the wires with which looks like a jimmy-rigged setup. I would do 2 looms, 1 power, and 1 for your cables. The mess at the bottom can be looped back up if you do it right without pinching/kinking them.

joe


Hey, thats a nice plasma, you can put that in the back of my truck...
OP | Post 7 made on Wednesday April 24, 2002 at 09:18
Dave Goodfellow
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Joe,

Thanks for the response, I have some split loom stuff at the moment but it is a bit small, it is only an inch in diameter, I suppose I could go bigger or put a third run in for coax.

Coax - TV downlead
Coax - FM downlead
Coax - Satellite downlead
Coax - SatTV out to distribution system
Coax - Video1 to Sat
Coax - Sat to Video2
Power - Amp
Power - Tuner
Power - Video1
Power - Video2
Power - DVD
Power - Satellite
Power - Pronto Charger)
Scart - Sat to Video1
Scart - Sat to Video2
Scart - Video1 to Amp(Phono)
Scart - Video2 to Amp(Phono)
Scart - Amp(Phono) to TV
Scart - DVD to TV
Phono - DVD to Amp
Phono - DVD Audio to Amp
Phono - Tuner to Amp
Telephone - Sat

I think 23 cables in all if I am correct. If done correctly the split loom stuff looks OK. I am still considering it but also like the thought of a strip/box on the wall to contain the cables.

Thanks again it is all good things to consider. At last the fireplace has been ordered, yesterday. Looking at floors this weekend then the work begins.

Dave
Post 8 made on Sunday April 28, 2002 at 21:51
glaro
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101
go wireless man
Post 9 made on Sunday April 28, 2002 at 22:23
Matt
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1,802
If the 'umbilical' method is used, we have good luck with the loom style stuff. Kinda like chinese finger torture device, but for cables...expands to fit larger bundles, and then can be 'snugged' down to make them tight.
Post 10 made on Monday April 29, 2002 at 19:36
jcmitch
Founding Member
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Posts:
May 2001
483
Having the cables cut perfectly to length helps quite a bit. I make my own from Belden, Synergistic Research, and Custom House Cable bulk reels and a Canare termination kit. MIT and IXOS also make cable package-kits w/ connectors that do not requre soldering.

jcmitch

[Link: synergisticresearch.com]

[Link: mitcables.com]

[Link: ixoscable.com]

http://www.customhousecable.com/

http://www.canare.com/
Post 11 made on Tuesday April 30, 2002 at 10:08
ECHOSLOB
Founding Member
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Posts:
February 2002
391
Sounds like the problem is your stand your not ready to part with. I just went through this and got a real equipment rack with wire management on the sides. I built a second floor in the A/V equipment room just for my equipment but we won't go there. LOL The rack is the coolest thing to do and is very neat and professional with wire management. I have all my A/V stuff,speaker home runs,networking stuff (cat5),router,DSL,coming into a patch panel then I made jumpers going to each piece of equipment. If I ever have to change of move something the most it would require possibly a longer jumper but I have slack in them any way wrapped and wire tied.
OP | Post 12 made on Thursday May 2, 2002 at 08:36
Dave Goodfellow
Founding Member
Joined:
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63
Wireless,

good idea. Stuff the TV, DVD, Video, Satellite. Just listen to the Wireless. This may only work in the UK where a Wireless is your Dad's name for a radio.

Does anbody do any wireless connectors of any worth yet? No? Well I just may start developing.

The stand, yes I am attached to £450 of stand, I can't afford a new one yet anyway.

I am looking at the websites for custom cables as we speak, will let you know if they are sued in the final solution. The floor is chosen, an oak wood floor and I ripped out the old fireplace at the weekend. So I will have a solution in the next few weeks and will report back the findings

thanks for the pointers

Dave
Post 13 made on Friday June 21, 2002 at 01:16
ItsColdInMN
Long Time Member
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June 2002
461
Time to break out the heavy equipment Dave. Go get yourself some good looking metal and start machining. Find a material that would match your existing stand and make your own cable raceway. If it's brushed aluminum (And don't pronounce it Aluminium either, cause it's pronounced Aluminum...no "ini" in it!!!) go get a piece that you could make the same length as your rack is tall, then put holes in at each shelf, make sure to finish the holes in a way that won't harm the cables (like grommets or smooth sanded), then finish the piece nicely so that it matches or compliments your existing rack, put it in the center and invent a way to make it stay there. With the cables out of sight, use any means you want to hold them in place. McMaster-Carr has lots of metals and plastics available to the general public(website too www.mcmaster.com scroll down to raw materials -> metals or thermoplastics). But with a little finess you could turn a piece of aluminum or stainless tubing or channel into a very nice raceway. And no one would ever know it wasn't part of your rack.
OP | Post 14 made on Friday June 21, 2002 at 09:34
Dave Goodfellow
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ItsColdInMN,

its a late response and I went with split loom stuff and it looks OK. I spent longer than last time getting it tidy. That said I would say I am far from happy. I never really thought of making things from metal. I'm more of a wood guy. Not a bad idea though. I'm giving this some thought.

Thanks Dave
Post 15 made on Friday June 21, 2002 at 18:29
ItsColdInMN
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June 2002
461
Yeah, that's the problem with these things, ya never know if the person has already gone ahead with their plans. Friend of mine had a glass rack and that's what we did though, I didn't do much with metal either, but it was really easy stuff. Hope it gives you some ideas for future plans
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