I could not find a place on the clear back of the spacer dimmer to place an emmiter. The only place that it would work was on the front. Does anyone have any ideas or know of another way to place the emmiter so that it is hidden?

Thanks

There's another thread going on right now about the Graffik Eye about the same thing. And unfortunately, then answer is no. They have a wide angle (180*) receiver, but they don't have a spot on the back. If you need an emitter on them, you'll have to retrofit something somewhat concealed onto the front.

avdude

I put emitters on the back of Spacers all the time, they work great!

I agree they should put clear backs on the Grafik Eye also.

I had the same problem. The only way I could make it work was to actually stick the emitter inside the Spacer right damn next to the sensor!

What the heck? Why is this, and how could someone have no problems with it?

I was using a Xantech system with a dinky link pickup.

The Lutron Spacer units with clear backs do have rear sensors. A properly functioning emitter will control the Spacer unit from the back. This brings a more interesting problem into question. National Electric Code does not allow mixing 120vac and LV in the same box. I have solved this two ways...
1: Specify three-way (two location) spacer switches so that you can have a second set near the display side of the room, where the remote will be pointing anyway...no rear emitter needed.
2: Install a high output emitter on the outside of the light switch junction box: Remove one of the empty cable ingress clamps from the box, and zip-tie the emitter to the outside of the box, facing in. Some inspectors will ask for an explanation, but will pass this arrangement. (There is no LV entering the box, only IR light.) MAKE SURE YOU TEST THE EMITTER FIRST, as it is a significant hassle to replace it after the walls are closed. Fortunately, most emitters have an extremely low failure rate.

Ian,

You are mistaken. The NEC DOES allow LV and 120VAC in the same box...there is a minimum seperation required of I believe .25 inch from the LV and the Line Voltage, but they are absolutely allowed in the same box when neccesary. Reading your profile, I see you're from California, so that could be the confusion. CA, or your municipality, may have a code against it, but the NEC does not prohibit it, just has minimum distances that must be adhered to.

Examples would be as follows:

Lutron Graffik Eyes
PHAST, AMX and Panja light switches
Some Lutron Devices
Some Litetouch Devices
Some Vantage Devices
Some Crestron Devices
Some Leviton Devices
CasaBlanca Ceiling Fans
Heatilator Fireplaces
Stewart, Draper, Da-Lite Film Screens controllers
etc...

All of these have LV control point right next to line voltage feeds, in the same box.

[Link: ul.com]

pay special attention to Section 725-54(a)(1) exception #2 and 2a

avdude

This message was edited by avdude on 11/20/03 10:34.

Thanks for the clarification, avdude, you're right, it is specific to my municipality in California, but it would not suprise me if there are other areas where the stricter rules apply. As always, folks, your local building inspector has the final say, so get on his/her good side by doing it all "above code".
Still not sure why several are having trouble with the rear sensors on Lutron Spacer...

If an inspector gives you grief about the wire, simply ask him about the furnace or a/c, and how they are able to use "control" wiring in the same vacinity as line voltage. This applies to most any line voltage product that is LV controlled.
Just an argument that might help you out someday.

Lutron markets an emitter for the Spacer product that clips onto an electrical box, without having to be inside. Two of them are included with the 5-Scene remote control, part #SPS-5WCR-. The only problem is, they don't sell it as a separate item (that I know of). Maybe after you have bought one, you will have a spare...

No, No, NO!

Don't confuse low voltage control wiring (Class 2) with Cat5 UTP communications cable (Covered by Chapter 8 of the NEC, not Chapter 7).

Yes, you can run low voltage circuits into a furnace. But the low voltage cable has to be rated for that purpose. Cat5 Is Not allowed as thermostat run directly into a furnace or A/C unit.

Yes, a lot of these switches and dimmers have low-voltage connections. But they must be installed and wired properly!

NO IR blasters or wire inside of a 120 volt electrical box. Ever.

NO Untwisted pairs of Cat5 inside of a 120 volt electrical box. Ever.

Some of the switches and dimmers mentioned have the low voltage wires coming out the top front. The wiring diagram shows these wires TUCKED INTO THE WALL ABOVE, AND OUTSIDE OF, the 120 volt box. Cat5 is great for these.

Drill a small hole in the side of an electrical box that has a Lutron Spacer in it and glue an IR blaster TO THE OUTSIDE of the electrical box. Keep the blaster, its wires and the Cat5 out of the electrical box! Always!
FYI: The IR receiver on the (clear) Spacer dimmers is best blasted from the left or right side. That's how their Master scene control works.

Other devices (Grafik Eyes, for example) use a Class 2 rated cable (This is where the .25 inches applies). But this is not for Cat5!!

One exception is when the outer jacket of a Cat5 is not removed and is instead terminated into an RJ45 Modular Connector. Some of you may remember the Phast dimmers that connected this way. Please have pity on the poor souls that have that junk in their houses.

Did I see anyone asking about the use of cat5?
I believe I specifically used the term "control wire". And under certain exceptions, it is allowable by code. I also stated that a chat with your local inspector would get you a big OK on the job if you asked him to clarify the definitions and explained to him what you are trying to accomplish, and if your interpretation of the code was correct. These guys will usually always help when they are asked. They are just trying to do their job and if he catches this, it means his eyes are open.

You might also mention that the “Spacer System dimmer ” has the clear back. The standard Spacer dimmer does not.

Further, Blink type emitters are only a 1/3 as powerful as non-blink emitters, so use non-blink emitters for this application.

I thought I'd bump this.

I now have a Lutron SPS-5WCR and a number of Spacer System devices, and I have a question about the IR emitters provided with them (and if you'd like me to tell you anything about them for future reference, let me know). I was wondering whether I could use these as an output device from a Xantech connecting block. As I look at the instructions for wiring the emitter (see page two of [Link: lutron.com] ), it seems that they have two leads similarly to a standard Xantech style emitter. So, I was wondering:

1. Whether I can take the IR out of the IR Receiver/Emitter (SPS-5WCR) and run it into the IR Receiver screws on the Xantech 791-44 connecting block, and
2. Whether I can take an IR emitter from the connecting block and wire it into the provided emitters that come witht the SPS-5WCR.

The purpose of this combination would be to allow multiple IR Recivers to "talk" to the Spacer System controls, as well as allowing the wall scene controller to "talk" to the Spacer System controls via a single connection. Furthermore, with IR Rebroadcasting enabled (not recommended I understand when using a 5WCR ganged with the units it controls - preventing a feedback loop), this receiver could be used to broadcast commands to the entire system. Thanks for any help!

I thought I'd put the numbers on the emitters I have that came with the SPS-5WCR I purchased so that you can see if you can get them too:

Sticker 1: Listed 6B38 (UL logo below) M43
Sticker 2: A449615 (part number?) "FOR USE WITH SPS-5WCR AND SPS-SERIES DIMMERS ONLY"

Any response to my earlier questions would be nice though too :-)

Bump. Does anyone know if this method would work?