David, don't get me wrong, I'm all for Crestron. In fact, we've just took on Crestron products. Crestron has by far, the best RF reliability, the most flexible programming, and hell, you can control just about anything worth controlling with their products.

I'm always up for a challenge, and Crestron has certainly delivered. As it stands right now, until we can get out for training, we are subbing out programming. Though using a CIP can have it's disadvantages.

I'll admit, I'm a little intimidated by the software, but also curious. I've only had time to dabble with VTpro, and only slightly get the concept. SIMPL windows, to me, is confusing to say the least. And I'm usually pretty good at working things out on my own.

I guess once you get the concept of how the program functions, things will become clearer, and more understandable.

I'm looking forward to doing the programming for myself, as this offers our company the most flexibility, and the ability to make changes should the need arise.

Thanks,

JJP

Sorry John! Watching the war pumps me up! That's great to hear you picked up Crestron. You will be cringing at an RF pronto shortly. Please book mark the Crestron users group at Yahoo. Tony started it and believe me you are way ahead of some and we are way behind others !

[Link: groups.yahoo.com]

Dave


This message was edited by DavidatAVX on 03/31/03 23:16.

With Crestron you can control Matrix routers....

Crestron also has matrix routers that transmit HD?comp./composite and audio 500ft + over CAT5 if need be.

John,

Make sure you receive the "source files" with the sub-contracted programming. These will be invaluable if you need to make changes later, and can be excellent learning tools (templates) when you start programming yourself.

Thanks Dave.

I am currently a member of the Crestron group, and have been following it now for some months. I have provided VERY LITTLE input for fear of being flamed for being, well, stupid. LOL

I have a project that we are currently working on that is using an ST-1700C TP. There are some minor issues with the control programming (commands aren't correct), but I hate to keep bugging the programmer to handle it. He is pretty busy, and it would be nice if I could take care of these minor issues myself.

Plus I can't test the cable box side of the control until we actually do the install in 2 weeks, so it would definately be to my advantage if I had the ability to make minor changes in the field when doing this install.

Thanks,

JJP

Tony, I have the source files for the project we are currently working on.

Like I said, I can look at the file all I want, I just don't understand what I need to do to make the necessary changes.

Thanks,

JJP

In my experience, proper design, application, and programming are far more important than the price tag associated with a product. I am all for Crestron, don't get me wrong, but I prefer to keep all service, programming etc. in house. Just to make sure we can fix any "little" bugs that come along without having to call in anyone. No guts, no glory is what keeps our industry going, but the learning curve should take place in the shop, showroom, office, or training facility, not a client's home. If you decide to go with a product that you are unfamiliar with, make sure to have the programmer or factory involved with every step starting with design to make sure that there are no "surprises" when the final programming is done("the salesman told us it could fluff our pillows!" "I'm sorry ma'am but this system doesn't have the wiring in place for the PIL-10 module, and at this point, we can't retrofit it")

"Don't be scared" :-)

If you review the message archives, you'll see the most BASIC of basic questions have been asked (sometimes multiple times), and always cheerfully answered. Some of the guys "live" to answer questions :-)



"Minor changes" are much easier than programming a system from scratch. I'm sure with a little help, you'll be able to make the changes in no time. In the Files section of the Crestron group, download the CNX Cookbook document. It's old, but is still a pretty good primer for getting started. Other than that, feel free to post *any* questions to the group, no matter how simple (or complex) they seem.

Thanks for the information Tony.

I will continue this in the Crestron group.

I apreciate your help,

JJP

Yes, Crestron is fabulous.

However, if you don't have access to Crestron, I have had success specifying the Russound pr4zi. It is a 6 source, 4 zone preamp. It can cascade up to 16 zones. It has fixed and variable outputs per zone. It has front panel controls that are easily manipulated. It has rs-232 control capabilities that can be manipulated to do things that the simple keypad can't do. You can use Russound keypads, or alternatively ir, or an ir-based learning keypad to control it. It has designated ir outputs and common ir outputs.

Again, if you can't get Crestron, a viable alternative.

I would love to do Crestron.....But not a chance. No way that my boss would commit to a new product like that. I can't even get him to try B&K. Too high-end for him.

So.... So far I think that either the Elan HD stuff, or the Sonance Navigator Harbor is looking nice. I think that Elan is a bit expensive, and has a few features that I don't really need in this system, But the new K2 keypads from Sonance look pretty frikkin' cool. It's an RTI T2 in the wall.

Has anyone used these yet?

Seriously, take a look at the Autopatch line of matrix routers, you can get SBC's (single bus controllers) that will allow you to select a source from any of the up to 256 sources. Level can be adjusted various ways.

Matt,

Got a link of anykind??

I personally think that all of the answers do not really meet your requirements, except for the Crestron response... but there is a solution for you out there. Check out www.zonaudio.com. Their new system is scalable to a LOT more zones then you will ever need and as many sources as you would like. It uses a router with nine sources and four zones but is expandable up to 1000 zones. No kidding! It also has capability for digital input via Toslink or coax and can do subzones also. It needs to run on Cat 5e or 6. Doorbell, paging, etc can all be done through this system also and their control pad/amplifier looks great too. Need more info, send me an email.