There were alot of feature requests submitted by LowPro, myself, and others during the major beta test cycles we were included in. Such things were the less than useful Browse Backward, etc... We all had comments as to a better approach. My hope is that these, along with variables, will now become reality.

Lyndel, your suggestions probably won't won't be included. If I read the promos, the new remote is designed by installers for installers. Have you changed jobs?

Ah variables. Is that something installers are salivating for? I know I am, but I'm just a simpleminded programmer - and not a very good one at that.

What you are seeing on Philips site is....... marketing.

That often has nothing to do with whether only ideas from the custom installers were included, or only the engineers ideas, or even if the boss's daughter's idea was put in just to keep everyone happy.

This teasing is someone in the marketing department's idea.

I remember on CEDIA where the newest Pronto at the time was kept behind glass and no one touched it.

Sometimes I think companies get ahead of themselves in marketing, and then can't even produce a prototype for a major HT show..... or the prototype is just a shell that doesn't work.

I do believe that Philips has probably included a lot of the good ideas from the CI's, and if a good idea came from outside of the installer realm, then that could be included too.

I think the thrust of the marketing is that at least someone at Philips believes that they are coming out with a remote that the is rock solid on the RF front; quick to program for the CI's; and is exactly what can be included in an installation by a CI.

Whether that proves to be true is another thing.

Some CI's post on here about how much they love a certain remote, and then the next post relates another CI's exact opposite opinion.

MY opinion is that these teaser advertisements are just silly.

Greg

Maybe so, they've released firmware updates in short turnaround timeframe based on my escalation of a problem with good repro steps (Macro cancellation issue). I'd like to think I've developed a rapport with the Belgium team. Only time will tell.

Browse backwards.. who cares?

Variables... use descretes.

Give me sensors and stored Macros.

Springs,

Maybe you haven't considered this scenario?

Say you need a 'Surround' device where you have multiple tabbed pages, navigable by the tabs in the single device. On each page, you want a consitent button that, upon a press, will take you back to the original device page from whence you came.

Jump Backwards will not work as you've navigated between 1 or more pages in the Surround Device. As a result of this, you must configure the consistent Back/Return button to Jump to a pre-defined page (CDs-Transport, DVDs-Transport, etc). This results in the user having to copy the surround device N times where N is an occurrence of a device where you need to Jump To Surround settings. (DVD, TV, CD, HTPC, etc...).

If we had a variable that could host a pointer containing a reference to the current page being viewed just before Jumping into the Surround Device, the Surround Device could have a button that simply did a Jump to the page contained in the variable.

So, although you may not have a good use for variables, there are many of us who do. The example I presented here will hopefully enlighten others as to extended possiblilities that availability of Variables supporting something other than true/false conditional logic could bring.

Lowpro, especially, could use the memory by having support for these Variable types. Quite a few pages in his PCF could be eliminated.

Yeah I don't program like that.. I tend to use the 4 buttons below the screen as the nav buttons. Button one (Left) as Transport Controls. 2 as Starburst and Menu controls. 3 as # digits. 4 as Logo Genere. You have to select Logo to get back to say Movies, Sports etc. Then when you enter a GEnre there are navigation tabs at the top of the screen.

No need for variables in that means.

Then there are variables for tracking equipment. Anyhting out side of power and things get a little screwy. Person turns off somehting by hand or a DVD player shuts down from inactivity.. then the On variabel is wrong. Press system off and it clears all flags then turn off everything to resync it.

Variable to track TV volume vs Preamp Volume.... just duplicate the device with cut and paste... VOL + - and Mute. Way faster then wrtiing and cordinating Flags.

Variable to track Play vs Pause... uhhh get rid of the samsung DVD player. It took me a few hours to get something that worked 90%... a 70 Buck Panasonic or Sony would have done it. Shoot They bill more than that for me to try to figure it out.

SENSORS MY MAN!

STORED MACROS

GOOD COMPONENTS TO CONTROL... wait that part isn't pronto its our product lines.

How I delt with a similar senario...
On the home/activites page I have a button in the bottom right that said Surround. This jumped to a seperate device that had DD DTS SURROUND STEREO CIRCLE as buttons. When you selected the home Icon it wne to a Duplicate Activites page that lacked the Surround Macro codes. Then the person selected the Source they wiched to return to or enter woith the current surround mode.

For the most part I have the App surround mode built into the macro on the Home / Activites Page like...
Jump to "Now Entering DVD mode"
Fuji -TV - Video 5
Marantz- Pre- On
Sony - DVD - On
Marantz - Pre - DVD
Fuji - TV - Video 5
Sony - DVD - Play
Marantz - Pre - DD/DTS EX/ES
(Sometimes I double up and repeat the above macro 2 times.)
Jump to "DVD Transport"

Return from surround screweing about usually just contained just the jumps or the macro minus the Surround sound Command.

The DVD management interface in my PCF currently consists of around 160 devices. With variable support I could reduce this number by half down to around 80 devices. That alone would reduce the size of my PCF significantly. Currently I have no choice but to duplicate devices. This has to be done so that each duplicated device can contain a specific jump back to the last device and page I was on prior to jumping to the current device. Now even if variable support is introduced I would still like to see a "new" special action which can accomplish this task as well. Said special action would "jump back to the last device and page you were on prior to jumping to the current device". This would at least rid us in most circumstances of having to duplicate devices to accomplish this task. Back to variable support ... with variable support our Pronto's could "monitor" power states only sending the power on or off codes to our gear when needed based on the last power code sent. Other remotes in competition with the Pronto line already offer this. Currently the only work around for this is to include a page asking a question to determine the power state, then followed up by another page asking if you'd like to send the power on or off code as part of the given macro based on your answer to the first question. This is what I've done in my PCF, but with variable support I could do away with all of that if I wish. While I'm on a roll here I'll mention another needed feature that's yet to see the light of day. This feature being the ability to tag a given page not to be included when browsing backwards. The most obvious use for this would be for loading pages. If we could tag loading pages for instance to be ignored (not included in the browse backwards stack) when browsing backwards this would allow for hitting browse backwards one time after a series of loading pages and being taken back to the page prior to the first of the loading pages. This is something that should be supported. Things like loading pages should only be displayed in the remote while a macro is running. The user should not be able to browse backwards through them and why would they want to. What they should be able to do is hit browse backwards one time after a series of loading pages has completed going back to the initial page they were on prior to the first of the loading pages being displayed.

I agree. I think flags (like RTI) or variables would be a nice option. My guess is that Philips is going to introduce the new remote with limited distribution and and a no-internet policy. They have hinted at a no-internet policy before and never really followed up. They know the current Pronto line is everywhere on the web at ridiculous prices and they cannot stop it at this time. They have lost hundreds of custom installers because of it and some other issues.

They want those CI's back and the only way to get their attention is to make the RF as bullet-proof as possible and limit who can sell the product.

Just my $.02..

Dave

Flags, variables, if/thens - any such capabilities extend the functionality of the device big time.

I hope Dave is wrong, but I'd guess he's on the money. If he's right, this forum is going to get a lot smaller. :-((

Never a problem for me.Who cares if it is on line for cheaper? So is everything else on my proposal! I give a short explanation of how the remote is shipped as a blank slate and at least 300hrs Programming R&D will be required to get it even a fraction close to what my company provides. Plus who's going to support it?




Is anyone having problems with the RF? Since the new RFX6500 came out, we have had nothing but success. Heck, I even use the emitters on super small and bid jobs!

I would like to see more durable and bigger touchscreens or even a wall mounted touchscreen panel utilizing the same software (would blow away a lot on the market now).

Or how about improving the firmware where it doesn't lock up when buttons are pushed too fast. Part of my initial training is how to take the back cover off and reset!

Or what about their support. Why not make parts available for custom shops like mine with Authorized service centers (sorry Mr. Smith, it will be at least three weeks until the remote comes back and you can use your surround sound set up. By the way it will cost at least $300 too).

I'm still bent on the new remote's size. And why didn't the Pronto Team contact anyone Via this site or us former Beta testers for input? I am not holding my breath with this one...


My .Rant

Makes sense, Grego. I agree the RFX6500 is been very good. Maybe they will have some surprise features in the new RF units. I noticed there will be two of them?

Yes, I am wondering which installers they actually talked with?

Dave

Why would this forum get a lot smaller. With extended functionality in the new remote, custom installers will be sharing ideas on how to implement the new features.

Perhaps they will do it in the Custom Installers Lounge, but why would they? I can see discussing how to incorporate the new remote into an install in the Custom Installers lounge, but as far as any new programming techniques, etc. I would think that it would continue to be discussed in this forum.

While the "power user" may not be able to get their hands on one of these new remotes, the CI's will still benefit from sharing their knowledge in this forum.

....... just my thoughts.

Greg

Because the hobbyists who make up a large percentage of the folks who inhabit this forum are unlikely to buy through CIs, especially if Philips clamps down on software access a la RTI. The hobbyists on this forum should take a look at the RTI forum - a very different place. The innovation you find here in hardware, power sources, graphics design, techniques , etc. is almost completely missing from the RTI forum. CIs are not interested in innovation that does not come from the mfgr. They are interested in making money - as well they should.

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